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Overcoming Addictions | Iman Cave
What are the signs of video game addiction? Is weed addictive? How does pornography addiction affect relationships? Dr. Omar Husain joins the Iman Cave to discuss the trials and consequences of addictions, its impact on faith, and how to curb what keeps us from Allah.
Transcript
This transcript was auto-generated using AI and may contain misspellings. It's out there, it's widespread, and the exposure is getting younger and younger. Last I saw, the recent was like as young as nine. Oh my gosh. She was like, look, I do not find any serenity, any peace in the prayer. I find peace by smoking weed. And I just said this, I was like, I'm going to say these words, I want to see y'all's reaction. I said, call me on my cell phone, and they all started laughing. I was like, how do y'all know what this is? I said, complete the verses, right? Yeah, they knew. When that hotline bling, it can only mean one thing. What's the one thing? Assalamualaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh. How's everyone doing? I'm Abdullah Oduro, and welcome to the Iman Cave, where we discuss issues of male excellence while being grounded in faith. Is it a habit or an addiction? Are they the same things? Are they detrimental to the man or the young boy? We're going to talk about that today, because it's very important, as we see nowadays, that our young men are addicted to certain things that they may say it's a habit. Is that habit good for their iman? Is it good for their masculinity? And this can be detrimental to their future as a human being, as a father, as a husband. Therefore, being an important topic that assists and helps in strengthening and honoring that male excellence, which Allah has created all of them to be. Well, today, we're going to talk together, inshallah, with brother Yahya. MashaAllah, Yahya Talib, another youth enthusiast. Alhamdulillah, speaking for a number of our young men here. Alhamdulillah, Bilal Meini. You're married, right? Yes, alhamdulillah. How old are you, like 30-something? 23. Say it again, louder. 23. 23, married. MashaAllah, Tabarik Allah. Alhamdulillah, may Allah bless you, man. Alhamdulillah for coming and representing. And we have the one and only, the illustrious sheikh al-Zaman, mashaAllah. He's the iman, mashaAllah.
Dr. Omar Hussain, licensed professional counselor. And mashaAllah, he's had the opportunity to come to our community in the Masjid al-Khopel and many communities to speak about this issue of addictions in particular, but in general of that of issues that are very pertinent to counseling, that require counseling. And make no mistake that all of us as human beings, just to be very honest, we all have our challenges. And that is how Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la has created us. We are insan. Therefore, we, even within the word, means that person or individual or creation that is forgetful, negligent. The most important thing is that we recognize those challenges that we may have and make sure that we address it in a particular manner. And going to someone that is licensed, that understands, and more importantly, understands what the Qur'an has implemented, the medicine and the sunnah of the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wa sallam, you sit in front of them, they know how to appropriate the message that is there for our young men in this particular situation. Firstly, Yahya, masha'Allah, as one of our new guests here, masha'Allah, so where were you born? So I was born in Dallas. You were born in Dallas? I was, yes. Where are you originally from? Syria, Damascus. Syria, Damascus, okay. When did you come to Dallas? So I was born here and for a small amount of time we lived here, but then my father decided that it was best if we were raised overseas. So he left everything here that he had been working on after he kind of saw that us growing in this environment, he was somewhat on the edge for it. So he decided to go back home where his family was and raise us overseas. And then we lived there for about 10 years. And subhanAllah, the war overseas plays a big role in a lot of people's lives and it played a big role in our life. So at some point when it was too much, my father once again had to leave everything behind and start over again here in the U.S. And that was probably like around 2012, 2013. And I've been here since then. Wow.
SubhanAllah, I have a bit of, I grew up over there, but I also grew up here. And I think both played a big role in me coming up. Yeah, and I'm almost sure it played a big role in your masculinity as well. Oh, absolutely. Seeing certain things and then your father have to start over certain choices that he had to make and you living through that. It's something that I mean, it's always going to be a story that you'll be able to share with us. Absolutely. Share with us inshaAllah as well. InshaAllah, absolutely. Yeah. Alhamdulillah, alhamdulillah, jazakAllah. Dr. Omar, how are you, Sheikh? Alhamdulillah. Alhamdulillah, alhamdulillah. If you can just start us off at Omar Hussein, when he was at the age of five, where was he and what took place when he grew up and left that particular habitat that he was in? Yes. So at the age of five, he was running around Southern California. Like Compton? I think that would come later. Okay. All right, inshaAllah, we hear you. Or being a wannabe, it would come later. Just running around the suburbs, playing sports, having a good time, playing video games. Good loving family, alhamdulillah, you know, and just enjoying the innocence of youth. So you studied in Egypt, is that correct? I did. In what years? I was there 2008 to 2014. Wow, so you were there during the... If you know your history, that's not just one, but two revolutions. Two revolutions in Egypt. Why have one when you can have two? Right, why have one when you can have two? May Allah protect us all, man, inshaAllah. So how was it studying at that time? I mean... I was there six years. So this came sort of towards the end. At that point, what you go through to get there, you're like, we're going to graduate and get through this. So you're like, we're going to graduate and get through this. We're going to graduate and get through this. So the first revolution hit, we had exams, and we flew back here because we weren't sure what was going to go down. Then we got word, okay, come back. So we went back, took our exams with riot police standing outside. And if you've never had tear gas in your eyes, it stings.
But then you have, you know, your classmates advising you, just put some Coca-Cola. Some soda, yeah. Some Coca-Cola, really? Okay, this is new. Put Pepsi right here on your cheeks. It's all about educating. Everything is Pepsi. Pepsi or seven, you know, whatever. There's only two preferences. So Alhamdulillah, so we got through that. And then there was another revolution. And I think you realize how soft you are as a Westerner, even if you think you're tough when you see that going, the stuff happening in front of your eyes. Yeah, it's deep. But Alhamdulillah, we got through it. Alhamdulillah, we came back. You know, we can come back, but there's always a concern for people that can't do that, right? At the end of the day, it's not just about what we escaped. Yeah. Right, and the taxi drivers will tell you that too. Like, okay, we're taken to the airport. What are we supposed to do now, right? So we make the drive for Muslims and difficulties every now and then. So from there, you graduated, you come back to America. You came back as an imam, correct? You were an imam. I came back, yes, religious director, just code for imam. But yeah. Yeah. So what prompted you to choose counseling from your ministry? Yeah, so before I left, I had a mentor at the masjid I was at, I grew up in. He was a licensed marriage and family therapist, which is very unusual and still is, but especially at that time. And so I said, why'd you do that? He said, well, because people come to me. And he's like, at some point, I'm like, I can only tell him make dua so much. Like, I didn't have an answer for them, right? Serious addictions, marital problems, clinical depression. So he went that route, and then he started fusing it into his community work. And his, mashallah, his khutbahs, like they were on point. And then you kind of understand why, because he's bringing in sort of this practical and this holistic approach, right? And it was funny. He told me, he said, so are you interested? I said, yeah, I'm interested in that.
Because we would also hear like, oh, well, the imams are not counselors, right? That was one thing. And it's not fair to ask them to handle all of those counseling, those responsibilities. So he told me, he said, you should go into marriage and family therapy, because if you can handle couples, you can handle anything. But I was more interested in just sort of clinical work. So I already had a, I knew I was going to do that before I came back. Really? So you knew you were going to do that before you came back. How was the course of study and how long was it? Just for those that are interested, I mean, when you... Yeah, yeah. So I came back and then I was serving my community. Okay. And I waited a year and then you need to get a master's degree. Okay. So the master's degree is, if you do it full time, a year and a half, two years. I did it part time, took a little longer. And then after that, there's a licensing process of 3,000 hours of supervision, which people need to know before they're going on the internet. Thank you. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, because most, if you're in engineering or in tech and you get a master's degree, you get a pay bump almost immediately. Yeah. Right. And if you don't, you're going to another company. Excellent. Here, you kind of got to struggle after. And then you have supervision and you're paying for the supervision most of the time. And you have this interim tag on you, right? So, and it was really restricted at that time what you could do as well. Now it's a little bit better, but it's a long process. Minimum, the quickest you can do it is a year and a half. And that's probably if you're killing yourself to get all these hours. Right, right, right. It's a big investment. It is. It is a big investment. And you have to ask yourself if it's worth the return on investment. For me, given everything, it absolutely was. But it's important to keep that in mind. Okay, so now that you are in this discipline, or let's just say this, Ibad, this worship, this work of fusing between ministry, imamah, and also being a licensed professional counselor. I mean, probably what you've seen while you're doing your 3,000 hours, you're like, okay, I see the synergy of being an imam. It's not monolithic, right?
I mean, when you're including this counseling, there's a lot of, dare I say, cultural nuances that come into play. Being that you're in America and you're seeing, you know, for instance, you'll see the generation gap between the parents and the youth, right? In this particular case, between the parents and the son. So when we're talking about dopamine, for example, that neurotransmitter, that it's the pleasure, the feeling of chasing that pleasure. What I've seen, and correct me if I'm wrong, we're dealing with these young men, and yeah, you could chime in as well, is, you know, I think one thing that I've seen a lot is, first thing to start off, let's just start with video games, right? Video games, we're not here to curse them, but we're here to allow the young man to guide himself through them, or be guided through them. What's your take on video games, and how have you seen it affect the young man? And when we say the young man, I'm talking about not only the young man himself, his mom that's screaming his name from downstairs, he's like, mom, I'm coming, all right. God, mom's always bugging me. Is that your mom? Or the older sister, or younger sister that he was supposed to take care of, or take out the dress. Does it have any effect? Does it transfer over to their life in a negative or positive way? Yeah, yeah. Video games. Okay, so the other day I was speaking with a teen client, and you know, he said, I like to play video games in my free time. I said, okay, what do you like to play, sir? He said, Street Fighter. And I said, hold on, what year is it? Yeah. Because I used to love to play Street Fighter. You, come on, man. But anyway, I just thought it was interesting how a lot of these things, they come around. Like, you know, my kids will be like, oh, Ninja Turtles. I'm like, and I tell them the Ninja Turtles. Oh, you know the Ninja Turtles. Yeah, yeah. All this stuff just loops around. But, you know, I think it's really important for us, particularly now, you know, we're not the same as we were 15, 20 years ago. I hope nobody is, right? But we can't just sort of blast and be down on, you know, video games. That's what you used to do, right?
Now, certainly we've learned what, maybe there's experience, this is harmful, maybe there should be limits, 100%. So I don't know if I would unequivocally say no video games. Okay. The key is to recognize when we have a problem with it. So there's actually, where I used to live, there's, it was the first ever video game rehab clinic. Wow. Yeah. So that's the first time I heard those words. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's a video game rehab clinic. Masha Allah. It's an actual place. It's an actual place. Physical location. It's a physical location. So when you think of like a drug rehab, this is it. But with video games. Allah, that's insane. Yeah. So they go there. Online stuff, like where you go online, you maybe like chat with your advisor over here. Yeah, yeah. No, this is never in person. No, this is, they bring you in, there's different levels. And the highest level is like working you back into society. If you're at, if you've been, you know. That's, that's specific. Yeah. So that, obviously that's, that's one level. But then there's, there's, I think it's really about healthy usage. Well, first of all, we back up content in anything, whether it's gaming or, you know, in any form of entertainment. I mean, we have certain standards as Muslims, right? So that's, that's important to keep in mind. I don't think we need to, just because it's video games, we don't need a single video game. So content, obviously, right, is something to be aware of. But then, you know, what is, is it detracting from major areas in life, right? Was the really good student all of a sudden now a mediocre student? Why? Because they're spending nine hours a day on video games. Was this outgrowing, vibrant, young, young boy, very social, all of a sudden now just recluse because all day video games, right? Are there not actual connections with human beings now because of the video game? That's where we need to be. For a mother, when can she tell when a, when a hobby is turning into a problem? Sometimes the problem is exaggerated because of the approach. This is, this is true in many, many things, not just video gaming.
So if it's a constant, you know, why are you doing this? What's wrong with you? You know, that constant sort of aggressive approach can be very detrimental and actually lead people to go in the opposite direction. I like how you say, okay, so, so Maxim, the constant, what was it? Constant questioning exaggerates. It exaggerates. It can, it absolutely can. It has a potentiality to exaggerate the problem or the challenge. And more so, people will just tune you out. Right, and I like how you say, because when you gave examples, you used the word you in all of them. Why are you doing this? Why are you doing, or are you, right? I mean, I've, I've spoken with people that use video games. They give some of the best advice on a cutback on video games, right? But when we're having that conversation, I'm not telling them that, how dare you play these video games? What's wrong with you? You're going to ruin your life. And family, in their love, that's very important, in their love, they kind of go overboard with it, right? And so that can even, and maybe they'll say, yeah, you know what? I was only going to play, you know, a little bit, 45 minutes, an hour a day, but now I'm just going to stay on here as long as I want, right? No, because you just start, start tuning them out, right? So that's, that's important to keep in mind. I think most people, if you're in an environment where it's not like that, there's a better chance to kind of be like, is this, I think it's a good idea. Look, look at your grades, look at your activities, right? I don't think we can put a number like, okay, five minutes for you and 10 minutes for you and an hour and a half for you. Yeah, really? Okay. I think most people would say playing nine hours a day is not reasonable, right? That's not, that's not healthy usage, right? When it becomes sort of this obsession. The key to look for really in any mental health thing is, is it having a major impairment on life, right? On life. On life, if there's some major life function. So if you're up all night playing video games and this is happening and you got a warning at work and then you got another warning, they get fired, we got a problem, right? If you're not engaging your family because you're always playing video games,
this is major part of life, right? If you binge every now and then, but life is generally good, I don't think that we would say you have an addiction or even a bad habit per se, right? We all have sort of things that we are involved in. This is the question, because you mentioned, you gave the examples of late to work and things of this nature, but waking up late for school, because the ones that most likely, most likely, I mean, I know there's men that do this as well, but the 13 to, the 10 to 19 year old, for example, for example, what are some markers that they can look at? Because you said it doesn't change life or it doesn't affect their life. So if we were to unpack that, what are some things that that young man, I don't want to use the word should, but it would be good for them to consider to ask these questions and to answer them honestly. Like, for example, am I waking up late for school? Okay, then this has become a problem. So are there some markers that they can look at that the young men, speaking directly to the young men, because before it was more of like for the guardians, for the parents, you know, don't exacerbate the problem by using you and, you know, pointing at them and telling them that they're up. But for that young man, what are some keys for him to think about, which will further make him responsible in this? Yeah. Well, an easy one is, are you getting up for Fajr? Boom, mic drop. Okay. A lot of them are when the usage is more sort of in the norm, right? They're like, oh, the console got taken away and I'm getting up for Fajr. Okay. Why are you getting up for Fajr? Because I'm not staying up till two or three in the morning. Let me stop right there, man. Just semicolon. Yeah. Because that right there, and that's why I mentioned, you know, even with telling young men, is you have to answer the question honestly. Yeah. You know, and I think that's the key. Correct me if I'm wrong in this, you know, and that's where the connection of, you know, Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala comes in because like, okay,
bro, you say to yourself, bro, you know you've been missing Fajr. Yeah. Or you know that Salah has been a burden on you, which is very interesting. You know, Ibn Qayyim, he mentions in his book, Why Will Us Say Invocations of God? He talks about, he mentions a Hadith, and the Hadith is a conversation between Yahya and Isa. And Yahya was ordered to tell the people about, it's part of the five pillars of Islam, it's a long Hadith in Tirmidhi. And then, you know, Yahya says, Wa amirukum bis Salah. He said, I order you to pray. After he mentioned Tawheed, the one who said, Allah, I order them to pray. And he said, Falat al-tafitu, don't turn. Ibn Qayyim says that turning is of two types, turning of the heart and turning of the sight. But then he says, when he goes and expounds upon it, he said, you know, when one is attentive, Shaytan will always try to poke at him and get him to either not pray and neglect it or become lazy in it, or within his prayer, and this is deep, within his prayer, he will be reminded of something that he was trying to think about before the prayers. And this could be something halal, you're thinking about it, and then it comes to you in prayer. Oh man, that's how I was supposed to beat that level. Next time I need to go around this thing. And you start, your mind is totally gone, your heart is totally gone. Yeah. And then he says the very end, and I'll leave it here, he says, so he finds the raha in the Salah and not from the Salah. He finds the ease in the Salah and not from the Salah. So when we, the Salah is like, oh, I gotta pray. Time to pray, oh, okay. So it's Fajr, like, okay, you made it, but then there's always an opportunity for you to get better at that. But like you mentioned, that should be like the first marker, okay, am I praying Fajr? And at that point, to be totally honest, you know, that first time that you attempt, you have that good intention, which is great, you attempt to make that prayer, the first time, it may feel like a burden. It may feel like a burden. Like, okay, all right, let me just,
okay, bismillah, allahu akbar. You know, and let's say three-fourths of the Salah, God, man, I just wanna go back to sleep, bro. Right, is that something that is realistic, but it's in stages, right? Like when you deal with the counseling, you deal with the young men, as you were talking about, is it something that is just one shot, or is it something that takes a gradual approach for them to get to that level of praying Fajr? Yeah, well, this is the great misconception that we have, because we live in a medical model, right? Which basically is like, something's broke, let's fix it. Okay. Okay, so you got a pain, let me give you this pill, take it three times a day, in a week, it'll be gone, right? We don't work like that as human beings. We're very complex, especially when it comes to the mind. And somebody who does that, just keep working on it. Like we work on prayer, just like we work to build our muscles, just like we're working on our business, school, anything. You just, you gotta keep working at it. And eventually, you know, like the drip of water on a rock, it's not gonna do anything for a very, very long time, but something will get through, something might be getting through, right? There's a reward system. So like, the first time you miss a Fajr... You feel like that bit of, man, I should have done better. I could have just woke up. And then when you wake up the next day, for example, let's say you put it to work and you wake up the next day, even if you're tired, even if you're exhausted, you even wanna go back, when you finish that prayer, you're like, man, that's a check mark. Like, personally, when my Fajr's on time, I know my day's a W, yeah, always. So what would you say is something that can help someone who is struggling realize that reward, or at least have it in their mind so they're not forgetting about it? Because it's very easy to forget about the reward if it's not gonna come right away. The instant gratification, it's sort of the culture that we're living in, right? Everything is, you just get it right now, right?
So if you can have, just because you can have everything right now doesn't mean you have to have it right now. Now, that is a simple change that anyone can make. Is a nine-year-old gonna be able to do that? Probably gonna need parental assistance on that. Can a 16-year-old do that? Absolutely. Can a 16-year-old say that my limit is going to be 45 minutes of gaming, or 50 minutes of gaming, and not two hours? Yes, they can. Maybe they need to start. If they're at seven hours, we gradually cut it down. But they can get there, right? So that is sort of training ourselves to not just have everything right now, right? Just because you can doesn't mean you should, right? To discipline. Yeah. So that is, it's building discipline, and ultimately, we will see the payoff, right? And the journey is sometimes more satisfying than the actual end result. Mm, that's deep, because, yeah. But again, journeying to who, and for what reason? That's where the, you know. That's the ultimate journey. Yeah, and this goes ultimately back to purpose, and that's why, you know, I always tell my communities in general, when we speak to youth, we're indirectly speaking to the parents. We speak to the parents, we're indirectly speaking to the youth. So like, when talking about the process and how it's, you know, the dripping rock, the water that's dripping on the rock, it'll eventually make an indentation inside the rock. What does that 16-year-old want if he's leaving something that he already wants and knows, the video games, from one hour to 30 minutes? Why, what's going on? Well, you're missing fudging. Okay, I'm missing fudging, okay, I'll make fudging. But then it'll come to, okay, but I'm not really seeing the results of fudging. I'm seeing the results in a video game. Yeah, yeah. Like, I'm disciplining myself. What are you talking about? I forget. He's like, no, discipline. I'm disciplining myself to go and play the video game. And I have a goal. I'm trying to beat the level. I'm making a goal. This is helping me mentally,
helping my mind-finger coordination, right? Although it was joking, there was some little truth behind it that he was feeling that was a truth for him, right? So I think it's very important when it comes to the youth that, okay, this is where it ties into their connection with Allah. Because it's like, okay, why am I going to fudging? Which one is more valuable? Okay, fudging. You were just told that it's valuable, but like you said, 16, that's the time of puberty, or roughly, that testosterone is kicking in mentally, physically, you know, they're changing, they're more aggressive. But that bridge of becoming responsible and leaving off that which they may desire for that which is better for them, right? And that's very, very interesting. And it's important that you mentioned those markers that they can have. So Frederick was one of them. What's one more that they can look and say? Well, you know, most people can kind of tell what kind of personality they have, how they kind of vibe with others. And again, when you talk in sort of a non-judgmental space, you'll hear people say like, yeah, we used to go out, like as friends, we used to go out, we used to get something to eat or whatever, and now we just like never do that. And seriously, like, don't underestimate, just because someone's young doesn't mean that they're not thinking or processing things, right? And you're like, mashallah, you're like 15. And you're thinking about this. Like, you don't need me to tell you, you kind of know what you need to do, right? And you know, the group, there's groupthink, where everybody thinks the same, but then it works also on the positive side, right? That's the idea of the jamaat. And now if you've got five 16-year-olds who are like, you know what, we're always gaming together, right? Because everybody's playing online. Let's do that for an hour, and then we'll go to the gym for 45 minutes. Or we'll just go, you know, do whatever. Like, all of a sudden now, it's not a burden anymore.
And you'll actually value the time that you have, because now it's like, well, it's not just endless. You know, speaking of gaming, I mean, in our house, I'm just gonna be honest, we didn't have rules, like you play from this time to this time, right? When we'd go to friends' houses, they had rules. And somehow it was more fun out there, because you know, you're like, oh, we got until five o'clock. That's it, it makes it more valuable. Your time is limited. Yeah, then your dad's coming home, and then we're not gonna have that. Then it's not happening. What are we gonna do at five o'clock? Well, we'll go swimming. Go play kickball, like back in the day. Go on the half-pike, you do skateboarding. But you value it, you value it, when it's not just endless. So would you say that's something for parents to look into? 100%, again, when you're talking, you know, in an ideal world, we would prevent a lot of these behaviors. That's the main goal, right? It's not till, oh, I'm 25, and you know, I've been addicted for 15 years. So at the younger ages, we also gotta understand the society we live in, it's a lot on the parents. Being a parent is not an easy job. I mean, you have to, the 10-year-old doesn't always know what's best for them. So you're saying pretty much, it's a responsibility on the parents to figure out what their child is like, and kind of figure out what they can do for that specific kind of, you know, situation, addiction, or maybe habit, to kind of get it either under control or in a positive way. 100%, right? It goes back to knowing your kid's personality. We were three brothers, one of us, if we had no limit, didn't matter, we would just play whatever. The other one, if it didn't have a limit, then it would be, you know, all day and all night playing, right? So that kind of goes back to knowing the personality and knowing, but you only know that if you're engaged with them and spending time with them. Spending time with them. No, I mean, you mentioned rules, but I think rules is very important, though. Because, I mean, you mentioned limits. Limits is, rules are limits to, it's basically showing the limits of a particular thing. There have to be some boundaries. It has to be some boundaries. It's not just a free-for-all.
The next question I have, or scenario, it's a story, it's something that happened to me. I'm in the masjid, I was gonna say in the masjid chilling, but you know, we can chill in the masjid, right? And one of my students comes to me with their cousin, she's like 14, 15-year-old girl, and I told her at that time, I said, I really appreciate you coming here. She was like, look, I do not find any serenity, any peace in the prayer. I find peace by smoking weed. I find peace by rolling one up, lighting up a spliff, a blunt, whatever it is. That's where I find my peace, right? That is definitely some type of addiction, which she mentioned, she was addicted to it, and she was happily addicted to it. It wasn't like she was coming to me, like, solve my problem, no, she was more like, convince me, right? She was expressing, yeah, her happiness. It was more like, convince me that there's something wrong with this. I remember when I became Muslim, you know, I became Muslim, and guys were like, look, the weed is from the earth, bro. It's free. Oh, man, I've heard that so many times. It's like, bro, it's nothing, it's from earth. What's wrong with it? What's wrong, weed is from the earth, khalas. It gets me, it puts me more in a, one of my brothers that led Salah one day, he, after he said, salamu alaykum wa rahmatullah, I said, he lit it up. So he lit it up and he passed it. After the prayer, immediately after? Immediately after. And the idea was, that's just, it's just like that. It's just part of. And I remember, I'll never forget, and I was, this is not to praise, but I was like, should we be doing this, man? And then one of them was like, bro, it's from the earth, bro. Khali, you're bugging. You're bugging, man. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, I'm telling you. You're bugging, you're tripping out. You're acting weird. Yeah. So, okay. Video games, all this is a form of, you know, secreting the dopamine, which brings a sense of pleasure. And hopefully transferring that dopamine response to something more euphoric that deals
with the shitty alpha law, which the law has legislated. But like weed, man. Do you see that as prevalent with young men and how do you counsel in that? What advice would you give in that regard? It's very prevalent. There's no doubt. That's for the non-Muslims, but the Muslims. For 100%, for the Muslims. Really? Oh, man. The human beings, right? Okay. Absolutely. And I think there's this, there's a tendency to single this out, like, this is okay. Right? The same people, if you ask, alcohol, no, no, no. You know, that's not. It's not from the earth. It's not from the earth. That's why. I guess, supposedly. Yeah, I mean, you get the grapes, you let them sit in here for a week. I don't think it's a nuanced fiqh discussion. I don't think we need that here. But if someone is convinced that it's okay, if they don't want to hear the other side, like this young woman, then there's not really much we can do about that. In fact, that's true for any type of person coming for counseling, right? So why are you here? Because my mom wanted me to be here. Boom. Okay. You don't really want to make the changes. There's not really a whole lot we can do. So the first is a recognition, and a lot of times that's lacking. There's not a recognition. Recognition, okay. Of the, that like marijuana is a haram substance, right? So until that changes, it's very hard to take a step. Now, for those that are, it's gonna be a process just like any other type of addiction. It also depends how severe it is, right? So somebody smoking every now and then is different from somebody lighting it up seven days a week, five times a day, right? That's different. So if it's less severe, maybe we can get by with less. If it's very severe, then we may need to take more drastic steps such as inpatient or outpatient clinics, detox, so on and so forth. I've found anecdotally in our communities, it's kind of like a social thing. So a lot like, it's like people will stop it when they're not in that environment, right?
So they were all in high school together, they were smoking. And then after they graduated, when's the last time you smoked? Oh, not since high school, man. Right. Oh, like six months ago. So that's not an addiction, right? That's just a bad habit that flares every, literally, flares every. That lights up. Every now and then. So it just kind of depends on the severity. But if they don't, if they're not gonna accept that this is not something they shouldn't be doing, then it's gonna be hard to just go anywhere. So what would you say? What would you say to the brothers that are convinced that it's not harmful or it does not have any effect on you whatsoever? Because you'll meet a lot of guys, man. You'll talk to them. They'll say, bro, I mean, it does nothing. It just helps me cool out, just cool down, chill out, do my thing. Matter of fact, I focus more when I'm on it. If Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la told us to do something, there's benefit. If he told us to stay away, there's not benefit. Whether we recognize all that benefit or recognize all the harm, it doesn't matter. It's still, we still have to follow it. So that's the first step. I'm not here to get in an argument with you. You can find anything you want out there about darn near anything, and you can justify anything. And people are doing that with core beliefs, and it's not. Right? And they can do that. So I'm not here to argue with them on that. What we're saying is, ultimately, why are we refraining from this? Because Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la has given us boundaries and guidelines to live in. Right? There's no end to justification. Well, you know, if I protect myself, then I can have relations with anyone I want. And I can be really, I can really protect my, right? There's no end to that. So it just opens up a box. Just slip your slogan, go back and forth. There's nothing to come down to. Yeah, there's no end to it. Now it reminds me of the verse, and this verse is foundational. You know, when Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la says, after I read this passage, yas'aloonak a'ani al-khamri wal-maysir. The people ask you about liquor and gambling. Qul fihima ithmun kabirun wa manafirun min nas.
He said, tell them that in both of those things are great sin and benefit. There it is, yeah. Wa ithmuhuma akbaru min nafihim. That's it. He said, but the sin is much more than the benefit in those things. And how, who knows the benefit? Allah. That's what he said. We don't, you know, if Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la has legislated it, that's what we say, samayna wal ta'ana. We hear and we obey. It's not a condition for our worship to know the reason of the ruling. Right. And that's the ultimate submission. And that is where I humbly feel that's the transitionary point from that young boy to being a man. A Muslim man, a responsible man, a purposeful man, a transcendent man. To where he says, well, Allah's not pleased with this. I'm not gonna do it. Simply, simply because Allah's not pleased with it. And I think the challenge is to where they have to be okay with that. Right. Right. And that is the drip of water. That's the process. You know, that first day of Fajr is gonna be, you know, 90% of the time you're thinking about, man, I'm just, I guess I gotta do this. Gradually. And that's where it becomes, you know, an unseen force where Allah affects your heart in that. And that's why when I was saying about this girl in my mind, as I was, we talked for like four or five hours, this young sister, like four. Cause I was saying in my mind, just like you said, it's not my job here to convince you, right? You already seem convinced. And the attitude of you asking is like, you prove to me. Yeah. I was like, no, no, no, no. We're not gonna go on down. If everybody stays in their lane, it won't be any, what is it? There won't be any accidents if everyone stays in their lane, right? So let's just make sure that, okay. Are you coming to get advice and trying to find out, firstly, what's your connection with Allah? What do you think about Allah? Come to find out there was some doubts in Allah in general. Right. Before even this issue. Yeah. This is a by-product. It's a by-product. Yeah. So when seeing with weed particularly, for young men, it really makes them irresponsible.
And even I've seen numerous times with non-Muslim old friends that I had, is that 30, 35 is from video games and their significant other is out the door mentally. And they're like, all you do is sit home and play video games. You go to work, come back, play video games, go to work, come back, video games, smoke with your friends, and that's it. So it kind of leads to him being lazy, irresponsible, and then ultimately not having any ultimate purpose. No ambition. Colorless. The life just becomes black and white. You're on a routine and you're just like a bot. Yeah. Looping and looping. Now I remember when we used to travel, because I played collegiate tennis, so we would travel with our teams. And so we were in the hotel one day and they just randomly pick who you room with. So I got with the captains. Okay. And I'm like, oh, dang, you're just new and you're rooming with the captains now, okay. And so I went out with some of the teammates. We did crazy things like eating ice cream. And there was another crew. So I come back and I'm trying to open the door and there's wet towels under the door. Oh, man. It's a greenhouse. And I'm like 17, 18 or something. I'm trying to open the door and I walk in and I'm moving it. And then one of the guys comes right and he's like, put that back. And I have no, I'm like, I have no idea what's going on. Oh, guys, there's wet towels now. I'm sure I sounded just like that. Hi, there's some wet towels. You got to move these. We can't keep the towels here. We got to wash our bodies with these towels. And I go, put that down, put that down. Okay. So I'm trying to like coordinate, right, what's happening. Then I went and sat down and then I kind of saw that they were broken. And so of course they offer me. And I'm like, I'm good. Now I had no idea how to get it. I know there's some, sometimes we're in. Fattakullaha maslata. Have God consciousness to the best of your ability. I had no idea what I was,
the next day I was praying in the corner. Where am I going to go? Pray in the middle of the hall. So for those that don't know, because of course the audience doesn't know, Alhamdulillah, the towels were there to block the smoke from going. So the coaches don't smell it and then come. And I always noticed one of them was, but he was so laid back. And now I understand why. He was like, nah, nah, nah. You see the stars, man? What stars, man? We're in a doorway. Nah, there's some stars right there, bro. I'm telling you. The aliens are coming, man. Oh man. But you know what? He lost his match the next day and he cost us that tournament. Really? So I haven't forgotten it. Good player, but you know, he just was off. So it's, I mean, you know, because sometimes guys let a little stress off, man. And that may do it for them. You know what I'm saying? So. Well, there's healthy outlets and there's all kinds of ways to let off stress. Exactly. What are some of them? What are some of the healthy outlets? What would be a good swap? Because for me personally, I mean, sports is a huge thing. If I'm able, like, it's literally my drug. I call, like, my mom tells me, you're going to have to play soccer again. It's like almost, you know, 12 a.m. I'm like, mama, if I don't do this, I'm either going to just get depressed or go a different route. So this is my outlet. Like, this is, even if I don't win, even if I have a horrible match, I get, my body gets that relief that I'm able to get it off of me. And I think, I think, Suphanallah, it's kind of transferring that dopamine release. Because you find your pleasure, it's euphoric. I mean, there's nothing like a buzzer beater moment. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Where the time is winding down and you make that move and then, or your teammate makes it, and then it's just the crowd's going wild internally and then externally as well. There's nothing like that. But then allowing that also to be a buzzer beater moment within some type of, even though that can be a Ibadah. Yeah, it is. It is. It is a Ibadah. Definitely. But to where when it's, okay, I have those alone moments as well, when I'm reading the Quran or I'm praying
or I'm sitting with good companions that are talking about good things. Yeah. You know, I think those, it's really that element of transferring that dopamine from smoking weed, from porn, which you're going to talk about, from video games, to where they make that conscious choice to do these things that they know are better for them and how they know it's better for them because it's generally prescribed by Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la and the Dean of Islam. And I think that's a healthy transition from boyhood to manhood. Yeah. It unlocks, I mean, it unlocks a habit that allows the dopamine to just run. Because otherwise, I mean, it puts you back on it. The bad habits turn into good ones and the good ones keep bringing more good ones. When you're going out with good brothers, you're having a good time with them, you're playing, you're exercising, then that becomes, okay, let's do Isha after we work out. And then after we work out, you know what, let's go get something to eat. And then when you go eat, the conversations you have are normally productive conversations. How do we, as young men, how do we increase our deen, increase our iman? How do we make more money? And when you have a big group, a small community that turns into a bigger community, then you start to have a lot more power as an individual. And we don't have a lot of that as young men. Power. I think that's important for a man to strive for is power within himself to show that you have a level of authority and control over yourself, which will have an effect on others. I don't know if you mentioned, you know, when the guys hang out and then one gets up and says, yo, bro, I'll be right back. And they're like, where are you going? I'm just gonna go pray real quick. I'll be right back. Just that little, I've heard so many stories from brothers that were Muslim at the dawats, right? They call them the dawats. The dawats is like the, how would you say, like the party? The parties, yeah. Yeah, where it goes down, right? No, it's the parties, right? The cultural parties, right? And I remember one brother, he was Muslim, but internally he wasn't. He told me I was not Muslim. I gave up on God, Islam, and it was his cousin. That guy would say, hey man, I'm just gonna go pray.
And one day he was like, come on, just go pray with him. He said, I went and prayed with him that day. He said, it just put something in me. And then one time I heard a lecture by one sheikh here, and that's when it really just changed my life. I was really like, man, I started doing self-review, introspection, thinking about my life, thinking about what's going on, and then it just opened a door for me. A sahib sahib. A sahib sahib, yeah. Your friend is the one that brings you closer, right? So many stories. I mean, I remember there was a non-Muslim brother. He was hanging around a Muslim, and it was a Super Bowl. And then it was like, it was a halftime show. Gotta go. The Muslim got up and went to pray, and he's like, where are you going? He's like, I'm gonna go pray. He said, I made so much fun of him. You gotta go pray, it's the Super Bowl. But he said, from there, that was the seed. Even though I made fun of him, it was the seed for me to go and learn about Islam, and he eventually became Muslim and went to study, and now he's a sheikh. So, transitioning on to the last one. So we talked about weed, we talked about video games, and these are, I mean, we could say this is almost every Muslim, every Muslim. It's prevalent. Yeah, it's prevalent. No, I was gonna say almost every Muslim knows. No, I was gonna say not almost every Muslim does. They know that this takes place within our young, our young men, and even young women as well. But this challenge here of porn, of a young man looking online or on television at two individuals doing that particular act, impermissible act, what do you see from that causes the addiction? What about it causes the addiction? So, video games, it's feeling like a hero in a particular village or whatever video game you're playing, defeating the enemy. That mode of aggression is being let out. Competition, which is inherently a male characteristic, which is fine, and you're using it in that way, but which can be detrimental, which we talked about, from communication, communicating with others, and not time management, not being responsible. Weed, same thing, not being responsible,
destroying your body, ultimately in the process. But this here, porn, how is that detrimental to a young man's development? There's a lot to discuss there. I think someone referred to it as the porn-demic. Wow, okay. Right? Okay. It's out there, it's widespread, and the exposure is getting younger and younger. Last I saw the research, like as young as nine. Oh my gosh. And a lot of times it's not even intentional. Right, and this is very important when it comes to those who surround the person with the addiction to help them, because a lot of times it's unintentional exposure. What nine-year-old is going on intentionally looking for stuff, right? Something pops up, something is school, right? And so that can lead to that. The problem with this, particularly for men, is it's basically Shaytan twisting something which naturally we have inherent in us. We have a natural attraction for women. As a matter of fact, it is the greatest tribulation. ma taraktu ba'di fitnatan, adh-dharra ara rijali minan nisan. Prophet Salaam said in Bukhari and Muslim that I have not left a temptation greater for men. It's not diminishing women's status by any means, but this is a reality. Now we want to pretend it doesn't exist, that's fine, you can go live in your, you know. Fantasy. But we'll live in reality here. So this is a great trial and tribulation for men. So this is the ultimate form of exaggerating that. You know, we talk about dopamine. Dopamine, when you walk in here to do this, there's a hit of dopamine. It's like, oh, we're gonna have some fun, right? Now, what these addictions do is they get us to unnatural levels of dopamine that we weren't designed to handle. And so now that becomes the norm, you see. So now, if you can just swipe or type in a web address and you can see anything you want, and you can see 20 different women in an hour.
Now, when it's time for the halal relationship, it's not as appealing because that person is not artificial. That person has emotions. That person has ups and downs, right? And this is the greatest thing for young men who are on the edge or not involved, that it can vary, there's a high probability it's gonna affect you later on. When Allah gave you an outlet to make it halal, which is through marriage, right? This whole thing like dirty and all that, we have etiquette as Muslims, of course, but Alhamdulillah, within a context of marriage. So if some young brother's watching there, he's like, oh, I saw some or my friends are watching it, just be warned, this could affect your life for years and years to come. And it may even affect it in other ways, which maybe for the older audience, they would understand as well. So that's why, again, it goes back to the prevention is the most, that's the most important thing. In terms of other things that can happen to your question, we find it's not unusual to start on something more tame, and then it gets into more, more nastier and nastier. And you'll find the person will be saying after a year, they're like, man, I remember I just started, I would like watch some provocative videos, music videos or something, it wasn't porn, but now I can't, like I'm disgusted with myself, but I'm getting like, what's happened? It's just like a substance, you build up tolerance, right? That's why the drug dealer on the playground, the first hit is free, wants to draw you in. They draw you in, yeah. And then, so this kind of gets them in, and then, but after a while, that's not enough. Yep. So you need something more, you need something more, right? Yes, Alhamdulillah. And it's actually growing in young Muslim women as well, not at the same levels of men, but absolutely prevalent.
So I've worked with clients that you see like, maybe they had an affair or did other things, where did it all start? It all started with the pornography. Really? And that's where it started. It creates a fantasy that they want to turn into reality. It's a fantasy, and they have to fulfill that fantasy, and there's so much that comes from this. I mean, subhanAllah, you think of, and it just reminded me, I remember, there was an eight-year-old boy, he received this from his friend, a small strip of paper, and it had a, it was like an address on there, like an email address or something. He went on there and it was a porn site. So then he went and told his mom, come to find out that the other eight-year-old boy was giving this to other eight-year-old boys in the classroom, right? So it's kind of like- That's insane. Yeah, but you find, just like you mentioned, it's a natural thing within us to be attracted to the opposite gender. Maybe now with even eight-year-olds, subhanAllah, which is about a good seven years before even puberty hits, you know? But sometimes it's like that eight-year-old has maybe 15-year-old brothers, six-year, that they want to be like. Right, yes. And then they're, which is natural, which is normal, which is good, right? Or they may catch their father, uncle, doing some of these things, right? And they say, okay, boy, you watch this, and then, you know, or learn from this, right? What I've seen is that, subhanAllah, it creates unrealistic expectations, makes them very irresponsible. There's a really good book, The Boy Crisis, by Warren Farrell. You know, he talks about how, you know, the effects of porn, and from that is, it takes this very honorable union between a man and a woman, and it cheapens it. Yeah. To where when you look at, now I've seen, you know, young men, look at young Muslim women, you know, at these conferences, these Islamic conferences, and they look at them as a piece of meat. Yeah, they just start rating them. Start rating them. Start rating them. That's like a go-to. Every single guy you'll talk to,
if there's women that pass by, seven out of 10. Really? Yeah. Yo, that's crazy. You could be, I mean, man, it doesn't even matter what the age group is. You could be with like a bunch of 30-year-olds, maybe, who are even married, and it's just a joke. I mean, it became a joke, but in reality, it did start in a very dark place. Interesting. It's upon a lot, yeah. Interesting, yeah. So you just look at them as a body. Like you said. Yeah, it's a conquest. It's upon a lot. Upon a lot. It's upon a lot, and that is very unhealthy for the Muslim man that's gonna be responsible because it takes him on a more of an animalistic approach, and that's where, you know, sometimes they'll find themselves, you know, imagine if you combined all three of these, right? Video games, weed, and porn. I mean, you probably would be someone that doesn't know how to communicate to her in the future when you speak to a potential father-in-law. You don't know how to talk to him. He's gonna look at you like, yo, can we hold a conversation? And you're not that responsible. You probably have a job, a degree, maybe, but you don't seem like you have any goals or ambition because you're always on weed, and then you may look at the female, his daughter, as someone that is just a piece of meat, someone that is not someone that you would respect and honor that's gonna be a future mother. Wife and a mother, yeah. Wife and a mother. That's the beauty of the son of the prophet, when he says, your mother, your mother, your brother, when he asked the prophet, who has the most right in my companionship? I think it's crucial, always, as Muslims, this is connected to a higher purpose. Right. I can give you a secular argument against marijuana. I can give you a secular argument against pornography, and those can be useful, but that's not what it's all about because eventually, it's gonna end with, well, if you don't have any belief in something else, well, then, as long as you're not hurting anybody, you can do whatever you want, and what is the argument against that? If you don't have any purpose, if you don't think you're gonna be resurrected and questioned, then, let's be honest, we would just do whatever we want, right?
If we didn't have Islam, who knows what life would be? Yeah, and that's why it's a foundation. It's the anchor that brings it all together, you take it back. It is a core component. It has to be part of this process for anyone trying to get out of these things. If it's not, you know, then there's a huge hole that's not gonna be fixed. Because firstly, when you talked about, like, for instance, it'll start off by listening to music, you know, listening to certain types of music, whether it's the girl talking about her love story and her epiphany to this particular man and this, you know, this, you know, prototype of someone that is just a perfect guy, or it's the guy talking about how he dogs women, right? Or I tell you, you know, certain things that he may say that insinuates some type of sexual interaction with her without any type of emotion, without any type of regard and loftiness of the woman, or any type of respect of the man and the leadership of the man. So that, if they're listening to that consistently, it's going to take a toll on their, you know, on them. I remember I was amongst a group of young girls just talking to them about masculinity. So one of them was like, why are we sitting here talking about masculinity? Shouldn't you be talking to the boys? And I just said this, right? I was like, I'm going to say these words. I want to see y'all's reaction. I said, call me on my cell phone. And they all started laughing. I was like, how do y'all know what this is? I said, complete the verses, right? Yeah, they knew. When that hotline bling, it can only mean one thing. What's the one thing? Do you think that one thing is there to be a man that's going to protect you and honor you or to, and quit it, right? And where's it going to leave you? It's going to leave you emotionally attached to him and he could care less. So when it's these things that we're watching, television shows that we're watching, and make no mistake that it will take a toll on you and the way that you view the opposite gender, which will have a detrimental effect. Remember, we're imams sitting here. I mean, we've seen the effects of a man
that when he takes those layers off, it was, yeah, when I was a teenager, this is the relationship I had with a woman. Or when I was a teenager, this is how I really viewed, I grew up watching porn all my life and I realized that I can't treat a woman like that. And they got a divorce because the woman saw that he was a totally different individual at home. Ask divorce lawyers. Oh, man. They'll tell you that. SubhanAllah, Allahumma stan. May Allah protect this man. But definitely, man, mashallah, I think it's very important. And I like how you mentioned something else, which made me think that you joining, I don't even want to say joining because it's inherent within the deen of you being a counselor, right? But it brings it practical sense to the imam's lifestyle. Because let's be honest, a lot of times, young men, young women, youth, when they see the imam, they turn the other way. They're like, yeah, okay, let me go somewhere. Because the imam sometimes does not understand their reality. You know, myself, I didn't grow up in social, I didn't grow up with internet. You know, it was Zelda and Super Mario Brothers. But then with the internet, it's my responsibility to kind of have some kind of understanding of what they're going through, particularly the young men, what they're going through. And I think it's important that there's a synergy that you have, mashallah, to Barak Allah with counseling and really assisting the young, the Muslims in general, but in particular this situation, the young Muslim men in specific. And you yourself, you know, mashallah, you said you got married in your 20s. Yeah. You know, I always tell my friends, there is some luck to it, but wallahi, it's not really a lot of luck. It's me and my brother came to a conclusion one day that we're not going to look for a woman, we can't. It's impossible. We were looking around, we're like, man, it's so bad out here. Funny enough, but seriously, because you look at your parents, for example. I look at my mom. My mom, she's a perfect, I love my mom and everything that she stands for.
All our mothers, all our mothers, Allah protect them. They're great examples. And they're not the same. You don't see those same qualities as much anymore. But subhanAllah, so what we came to the conclusion is, khalas, like, we're just going to give up for now when we're going to work on ourselves. And what I realized was the more you try to attract, the more it causes problems. So you just got to work on yourself and that automatically attracts the good to you. Hold on, stop. The more you try to attract, the more it causes problems, unpack that. If you try to do things before the time is right, or if you push yourself beyond what you're supposed to do, then you end up kind of shooting yourself in the foot. A lot of men will try to go attract women and talk to girls and do all that. But it's like, bro, where's your Iman? Where's your deen? When was the last time you made a dua for a good girl? Like for a good wife to come in your life? A lot of brothers don't even think about like deen and they just let it go. So what happens is you attract all the bad potentials because trust me, the good potentials, the good women will not pop up if you're in that route. If you're not a good guy, Allah will not send you a good girl. It's as easy as that. So it's funny, when you put yourself in that position, Allah will make it happen. I used to, there's one verse in the Quran. أَزْزَنِيَةُ الْزَّنِيِّينَ وَالْمُؤْمِنِينَ الْمُؤْمِنَاتَ I used to think, man, like, and this is a real problem. I'm gonna be very blunt right now. Especially growing up here during my high school years and you see all the men and the women, the girls and the boys. Man, it's like, it's crazy. I mean, you tell them, it's almost embarrassing to say you're a virgin. You'll get cooked. Oh, man. One time, a lot of this funny story, I was at work and this lady was talking about her, her whole sexual life and this is another thing. They have no haya in that, which is kind of crazy. She was talking about it and then I was there and I was trying my best to just not avoid the convo. She turned at me and she asked me, she was like, what's your body count? So I laughed and I was, you know, I wasn't embarrassed, but I knew it was coming.
Oh, just, just, just, just, just, just, just. Parents, okay. This is common. If your son is working, even amongst Muslims, man, that's just, I mean. Yeah, I mean, where are we right now? Right. Body count means how many people have you had sex with? That's what body, so what's your body count means? How many, not have you, okay? How many people have you had sex with? Continue. SubhanAllah, I just laughed and I said, nah, I, zero. I don't really get into that. And she just smacked her hand like this on her head. And she just started laughing. I was, you know, I just, I just played it off. And subhanAllah, it just made me realize that, man, we are really at a time where we are the strangers. Tawbah, there's a lot of that. So we are the strangers. So alhamdulillah, I made the decision that even my brother, we kind of talked about it and we laughed about it, but we said, khalas, like, we're not going to look for it. If Allah doesn't make it happen, we're not going to do it. SubhanAllah, when you do that, wallahi, wallahi, I promise you, you just, it came out of nowhere. I wasn't even done with college. And Allah, subhanAllah, sent someone who's exactly what I was looking for and even better than me, alhamdulillah. So it's, it's not a point. We noticed how you try to get points there. No, but that's it. I mean. We see you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. SubhanAllah, Allah bless you. But, and this is the question I wanted to kind of follow up on that. A lot of brothers know and a lot of sisters know the problem they're having. And the reason why they run away from imams or turn around is because the imam embodies the problem. He knows that, okay, this is, I have to confront myself when I see him because there's no way, I can't finagle. He's going to ask me, halal or haram? And I can't, I can't say no. It's a wall. So people that do know that, people know there is, people know that I have a problem and it's bad for me and it's causing me problems. And they want to take that step forward. What is your advice to a brother who's having addictions with any of these substances? What is the first step forward? If your brain is used to this for 10, 15, 20 years
and you haven't been able to stop it, you're probably not gonna be able to stop it with what you're doing. Whatever you've tried. So you gotta change it up. It's not working, right? That's the definition of insanity. Keep doing the same thing over and over again. What we find in our communities is now they're like, okay, I know it's wrong. I want to stop it. Now what do I do? I don't have anywhere to go. So they just keep getting pushed further back and further back and further back and further back. I tried so hard to start like a support group for Muslim men around this topic in my previous community. And it was like, well, we can't do it in the masjid because we don't want people to know that we're here. Okay, okay, I respect. How about the building outside? That might work. I don't know, we can't do that because then they're gonna see the cars. Shame, shame, shame. How about a room in a library? Okay, that might work. But then like, are they gonna tell, what if I see somebody and I'm like, hey. Oh, did you see this guy? He was like, oh man. It was just this over and over and over again. And nothing, bottom line is nothing got done, right? After years, we finally were able to get one going where there's, it's virtual, so you can keep it a little more. In the comfort of your home. Yeah, exactly. Cameras off. Names changed. You can do whatever you want. You can get some crazy AI in there, some British accent, whatever you want. And knock yourself out. But the idea is there is support. That's a very simple, cost-effective thing for masjids to start. Something to support the people with this struggle. And I found that, this is an indicator of long-term success as well, support. So they don't have any support. So if you've been doing this for years and years, step one is you need to reach out to someone that can maybe give you some tools that you're not able to have.
Most of the people involved in this, the young men, they are not bad people. And it reminds me of Abdullah radiallahu ta'ala an, in the hadith, which we'll just mention quickly for a reminder. This was of course, someone in the time of the Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam used to make him laugh, right? The caravans would come in and he would, maybe some garments came in. And so he used to take gifts to the Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam and then the merchant would ask for the money. Cause in that day, I mean, you're not going to carry around like a bunch of money and it's not safe. So it was very common. You come back home, I'll give you the money. And then he'd say, this is a gift for you, Rasulullah Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam. And they said, now you got to pay the merchants. He's a prankster. And of course, and think about it, for you to be the person who makes someone with the burden of carrying the message to humanity laugh, that's a special place. That's a special place to be. So he used to joke with him and, but he had another problem. And of course he used to drink. And every time he would drink, the Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam would not skip the punishment, the legal punishment. It wasn't like, oh, he makes me laugh. We'll take it. Every single, and they did this multiple times until one time, one of the companions cursed him. Allahumma la'anhu, may Allah curse him. How many times is he going to do it? Like he just keeps coming over. That sounds like an addiction, right? And of course the Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam did not say, ameen. He did not say anything to increase that. He said, laa tal'anhu, do not curse him. Why? Because this is someone you hibbullahu rasulullah. I know, and in other narrations, all I know of him is he loves Allah and his messenger. All I know of him. But he has this problem. This is how I would describe the majority of the men that I work with, with pornography specifically. I tell other people, I'm like, I don't want your daughter to marry them if we remove this problem. Obviously this is a problem. I'm not saying to do that.
But if you just character, desire to become better Muslims, all of this stuff, like in general, wonderful people. But the brain has gotten hijacked and it's hard to undo something for 15 years. So if it's not working on your own, there needs to be some additional support, additional help. Groups can help with that. Number one, because I think they can be put together fairly quickly. Number two, they're not cost prohibitive. Sometimes cost can be a factor and it's easier to take groups. So that's something I think, you know, if masajists wanted to prioritize, there's no question that they could have these types of groups very quickly. It's interesting. You said a couple of things jokingly, but I mean, this is a good start. And I love that you mentioned it. I mean, you can start Zoom, you know, online communities and literally AI your voice. No one knows who you are. You still get your question out. And then I think that's masculinity in and of itself, because you're willing to go and seek help. You're honest with yourself, that introspection. You say, look, I got to do something. First step. The first thing is that this is not good. Hopefully it's not good because Allah doesn't love it, right? And it may be not good because I'm seeing what it's doing in my life and speaking to someone willing to be out there. So you realize that someone else is going to know about it now. That's honesty. That's honorable. That's honorable as well. And it's indirectly kind of taking a risk. Yes. 100%. And all of that is masculine. All of that is masculine because you want to ultimately get better. You have an ambition to be better, which is a praise. And that's why when you said, you know, take this out, this is someone you want to marry your daughter to because you got to realize this person was honest enough to come to anyone, but particularly the counselor. Now people, you know, they might say, well, okay, I'm kind of hidden, but, you know, what if they find out my IP address and they link it to my... Like we need to kind of get beyond this if we want solutions.
If we don't want solutions, we can keep doing the same thing we're doing and have people coming at 25, 26, getting married who have seen more things than the biggest player used to see before technology. Right. In their 10, 15, 20 years before that. So we kind of need to get beyond that. It's not exposing sin if you're trying to fix them. You're not coming there and talking about everything you did. It's completely different. But people have this mentality sometimes. Omar Ibn Al-Khattab said something, رحم الله أمرين أهدى إلي عيوب May Allah bless a brother who gifts me my عيوب, my problems or my issues. And I love that hadith because he says gift. Like may Allah bless a brother who gifts me my problems. Because it is a gift. People won't tell you. People won't go up and tell you, hey man, you're off. Step back up. They won't tell you that. It's a gift really to be told something like that. And I think I want to ask you, Shaykh, a question. Would you say something as simple as following these habits with a good habit? Would that be a good way to start? Because sometimes, man, getting to those groups is very, very helpful. But even then, sometimes it's way too out of reach for some people. I feel like they're just not there yet. So how do you break the ice and get to a place where you can even get started with that? Well, firstly, I think, you know, as a prophet, someone said to Ma'idah bin Jabal, one of the things he told him, he said, He said, if you follow up a bad deed with a good deed, we'll erase it. So if someone is watching something online and they stop themselves and they click the X outside of the window and they get up and they just call their friends and say, Hey man, what are you doing? I'm just chilling. Hey man, let's just go to the coffee shop real quick. Let's just go to the gym real quick. Let's just go walk around. Or he goes and walks around his neighborhood real quick and just takes deep breaths and just thinks about what he's doing. These are conductive, good steps for him to take.
And as he mentioned, which is very important, especially with men now, having these groups. Yeah. It is so important, Shaykh, as you mentioned, being around other men. That testosterone, if that's a word, energy, when we hear the hadith of the Prophet, it was, I was behind the Prophet when we were riding on a donkey, right? They were always around each other. Men were always around men. And this is so important because you may be in a crowd of people, but you're still lonely. You're at your Masjid Jamal. You see everyone. You're amongst them, but you're still lonely. And it's important to be around those people that have those same experiences. And I know for a fact, and Shaykh can even interject on that, that is what's going to be helpful. That's a productive or realistic step, right? But we have to be aware when it's Shaytan. The IP address, I could just hear Shaytan just whispering all through that. I don't care about the IP address. Yeah, yeah. They're going to find me. Okay, then what are you going to do then? Oh, I'm comfortable. Are you comfortable now? Still watching all this stuff? No, you've got to do something. You said break the ice. And the last thing I want to mention is that it's not going to be comfortable. It's going to be awkward. It's supposed to be awkward. That's the whole point of taking the risk. It is going to be awkward. Masculinity is about doing those awkward things as long as you know that Allah SWT wants that from you and loves it. Whether it's praying and the time is about to go out and you go to the corner of the parking lot, or whether it's speaking to that father-in-law that you know may diss you, you know what I'm saying, but you still do it anyway, or it's breaking out of your shell and turning your computer off, closing that laptop and getting up and just doing something very, very weird that you know will 51% help you rather than harm you. Jazakallah khair, man. Jazakallah khair. Thank you for coming in. And talib. And talib means like student. That's right. That's a very good question. As always, man. Alhamdulillah. May Allah bless you all.
Alhamdulillah. You had a souvenir for us. Here at Iman Cave, we ask our guests to bring a souvenir or a gift that has meaning behind it. And Sheikh Omar said he has something for us here. I did, yes. I have here a tennis ball. A tennis ball. A tennis ball. Okay. Was it in the room? You got to toss it. I was going to toss it, but we don't want to mess with the mic. You see that? Maybe that's why. It was the ball in the room. There you go. No look. Oh, there you go. You saw that? You saw that? It's a little warm up. Okay. Now he's going to start kicking. No, I'll keep it down. What's the story behind this? So, there's a lot. I'll keep it brief, inshallah. So, my first love is basketball. Okay. It's not tennis. I mean, I was Steph Curry before Steph Curry, inshallah. Everyone hears this. We're on camera, by the way. I get it. But you see, clearly I wasn't Steph Curry because I didn't go anymore. Okay, but that's another story. But I was, like I could shoot. I could shoot. Inshallah. And then came freshman year and I got cut. Right? That's kind of an oxymoron. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. I could shoot. But freshman year. I got cut in middle school? Yeah. That's crazy. They were not Muslim, that's why. Yeah, yeah, yeah, man. You always need to justify. Very, very disturbing. I was really disappointed. So, then my older brother, and as we said, indirectly whether we want to admit it or not, we look up to our older brothers. Inshallah. And he also, because when he was a senior, I was a freshman, and he was like Mr. All-Star. He was in all the groups. He had all the AP classes. All the teachers loved him. And I remember I started a class, it was AP Chemistry, one of the most difficult classes I've taken in my life, including a doctorate degree. And the teacher noticed my last name. She's like, oh, you know, you're the brother. I'm like, yeah. She's like, he's one of my favorite students. I'm like, oh, you're going to be disappointed. So, what he said mattered. And, you know, he said, you didn't make the team. I said, no, I didn't make the team. He said, well, then you're going to get put in PE, right?
Physical education. I'm like, only losers go to PE, man. You've got to play a sport. So, I'm like, what sport am I going to play in the springtime? I played tennis like a few times. Hey, man, soccer's in springtime. But the hate that soccer has on this man is all good. Yeah, I didn't have any desire for soccer. I had a bad experience. But that's for another day, inshallah. So, then I just said, okay, let me just play tennis. Now, I had another friend who was very good at baseball. And the coach wanted him to play. And for some reason, maybe he wanted to challenge himself. He's like, I'm not going to play baseball. I'm going to try tennis. Very bizarre, even to this day, I think about it. So, we used to practice every single day after school. And tryouts came, made the team, alhamdulillah. Kept progressing, got better, right? Went through high school, went on to play in college. And alhamdulillah, I think I maximized my talent for starting at 14 or 15 years old. But when I was in college, Islam was very much a part of my identity. And it always has been, alhamdulillah. And I think that's very important for young brothers who are like, I don't have a story. You don't have to be at ground zero and then become religious or whatever. It's great to just have a little journey, right? So, I was, alhamdulillah, very openly Muslim, didn't have any problems. But I was also known as having kind of a temper on the court. In fact, they gave me the best racket toss on the team. I tossed it from the front, the back net or something, all the way to the back fence. It was crazy. So, one day, and so I would kind of lose it sometimes. And one day, I'm not even kidding, I'm on the court. And I'm like, kind of having like a meltdown, right? And I'm like, what kind of Muslim is going to display this behavior? When you go out with the guys, they're going to the club. You're like, sorry guys, not going to go to the club. They're offering you weed, you're not doing the...
You're doing all this stuff, and they know why. You're praying in the middle of the court for a asr because of practice, right? Well, what kind of... And then I started thinking, I'm like, well, the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wa sallam, if he came here right now, and he sees this Muslim kid just acting a fool, right? Causing up a storm and stuff. May Allah forgive us. I'm just giving a real... Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so, I was like, this isn't going to work. So, that was kind of another journey that started. Like, you can't be doing this, right? To become a little bit more calm. And alhamdulillah. But I think that the discipline you get out of sports is very important for young men in general. Some may say, well, you know, I don't really play sports. I'm like, yeah, because you're not that good. But that doesn't mean there's no room for physical activity. Because now, I mean, I haven't played in a very, very long time. But, you know, you've still got to exercise. Because... Your body has a right upon you. So, the discipline you get, you talk about the bond, spending time. What is a coach? A coach is going to point out your flaws, right? It's like a male soap opera. If you're on a team and stuff, let's be honest. That's what it is. In fact, now I think the programming is more geared to that than the actual game itself. The game is like two hours. And then they're talking about it. They've got the pre-game, the pre-pre-game, the post-game. Like, it just goes on forever, right? But it's all like healthy connection. You're working towards a goal, right? You're disciplining yourself, right? You're not going like Draymond Green every other time, right? This is all very, very important. But that was all. So, this little ball, you know, which was a little bit bigger ball before, you know. But, you know, Alhamdulillah, Allah opened the doors. When one door closes, two others open. As Ibn Al-Qayyim said, Alhamdulillah. So, that was just a little story behind this. MashaAllah. JazakAllah khairan. May Allah SWT bless all of you for tuning in. And please don't forget to like and subscribe and comment.
Anything that you've heard that resonates with you that you've seen resonate with someone else. The mothers, the fathers, you young men in particular. If there's something that resonates with you, an experience that you have, please put it in the comments. And we'll do our best to address it directly or indirectly. JazakAllah khair for tuning into the Iman Cave. Wassalamualaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh. Al-Fatiha.
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