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Mentorship, Purpose, and Contentment | Iman Cave
In order to live a life of purpose, it’s not just about what you do, but who you’re with. Dr. Sulaiman Abawi joins Sh. Abdullah Oduro and co-host Waleed Gabr in the Iman Cave to discuss the importance and value of mentorships for boys and the ways we can be good role models and leaders in marriage and fatherhood.
Transcript
This transcript was auto-generated using AI and may contain misspellings. Their identity revolves around being a doctor. They get their sense of purpose and fulfillment from being a physician. But the reality is being a physician is really not that glamorous. You know, we have to deal with a lot of stuff, especially in the emergency department. After a while, that novelty wears off and those people end up happy, which is why a lot of physicians are, you know, the suicide rate amongst physicians is extremely high. One time I was doing it and it was from Allah. Wallah, it was from Allah. Everything's from Allah, and this one, like Allah was like, shut up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. SubhanAllah, am I giving you a khutbah right now? And he looked at me, he's like, yeah, Baba, you're giving me a khutbah. I'm a doctor, sure. I have money, yes. I have this. I went on this vacation, great. But am I happy? And I wasn't. Assalamualaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh. I'm Abdullah Oduro, and welcome to the Iman Cave, where we discuss issues of male excellence while being grounded in faith. Alhamdulillah, I have my brother and co-host, Waleed Gaber. What's good, man? Assalamualaikum. Assalamualaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh. How you doing? Good, good, good. Living? Healthy? Alhamdulillah, kept the plane. Everybody's great. Alhamdulillah, alhamdulillah. We got my man, Suleiman Al-Abuwi. MashaAllah, may Allah bless you. Waalaikumussalam. Alhamdulillah, alhamdulillah. Good to see you. Nice to be here. Alhamdulillah, good, good, man. Earlier, you gave him some eyedrops. I did. Why'd you give him some eyedrops? Haram, the guy came here, finished one of his shifts, and now he's on his second shift in a 24-hour period. Yeah, Allah. So, what is he doing? Shopping, what are you? I think it's just, I think it's just- Working in the emergency room, my ER doctor shift. ER doctor? Yeah, yeah. How long have you been doing that? 14, 15 years now. Really? Alhamdulillah, yeah. So, you've seen everything? Just about everything. Now, I'm kind of slowing down a little bit, you know. I'm not trying to get too crazy with all the big ER stuff, you know what I mean? So, I'm all about the coughs and colds and ankle sprains now, you know. That's all right with me.
So, y'all go way back. I mean, y'all go, how far back? Y'all travel together? We did a bunch of things together. Yeah, man. I think we can implement the hadith here, if you want, Shaykh. Which hadith is that, Shaykh? I don't know, I heard there's a beautiful hadith of how you- How you really get to know somebody. Oh, yeah, yeah. The statement of Umar al-Khattab, right? He asked a man that might wonder if they knew him. And then he asked him, did you travel with him? Have you done business with him? Or have you lived with him? Yes. And the man said, no. He said, if we go, he said, go and leave for you don't know this person. Yeah. So, y'all like road dogs. Yeah, alhamdulillah. We spent a lot of time on the road together. Actually, we tested each other on the road. Oh, boy, how? We took a road trip from Dallas to Michigan. Yeah. Masha'Allah. And I didn't know the guy. He didn't really know me. I hardly even knew this brother, masha'Allah. We were just talking, we were at the masjid. We were just chatting. Finishing some security work for the masjid. Yeah, we were doing security work for the masjid. And then I just mentioned to him, I was like, oh, I'm going on a road trip next week. I'm gonna have to head back to Michigan. And he said, yeah, well, what time are we going? I'm like, are you serious? You crazy dude. So I came home, I told my wife, I'm like, yeah, I think his brother wants to go with me up to Michigan. She's like, who is he? I'm like, I don't know. But alhamdulillah, we ended up really getting to know each other really well. And alhamdulillah, we became really close friends. So alhamdulillah. You know, it's interesting. There's a number of studies that are showing that from the transition, like a boy becoming a man, it is necessary that he is amongst men in order to learn how to be a man. And I think this is important because when we're talking about purpose of life and a man having purpose as a Muslim man, particularly having that ultimate purpose, you know, being around people that live that same purpose, they use this term called rites of passage. Yeah, I mean, just going off of that, one of the things I can tell you for myself personally
in my life that really made me who I am today is having mentors. You know what I mean? When I was growing up, of course, my father, Allah, he was the best mentor. But when, you know, when you're a boy, you're growing up, you think, you know, you think your dad, he's great, but you want more. You know what I mean? And then I got really interested in cars when I was young. And I just was all about like souped up cars and everything. And I gravitated towards a mentor who was actually my shop teacher. I took classes in high school on how to fix cars and all that. Where was this? This is in Guam. I grew up there. Is that a real place? It's a real place, yes. G-U-A-M. So it does exist, Shaykh. It does, okay, okay, okay, mashaAllah. Other corner of the world. So where America's day begins, actually. That's our logo. Is that true in Guam, I remember your father, and you established the first masjid. First masjid there, yeah. In Guam. So I actually built the dome that's on top of the masjid. The kubba. You're from Ibrahim Al-Quaid I'm from the house of Ismail, and may Allah accept you. And he named his son Ismail. Allahu Akbar. Man, it's beautiful, man. And Ibrahim. So I'm actually planning on going to Guam next year to see the community, and to actually, this mentor that I was talking about, he's been teaching at that college for, at the community college for, I think now going on 40 years, and he's retiring next year. And I still keep in touch with him to this day. And I told him, I said that, and bear in mind, he's not a Muslim, but he's a wonderful, wonderful man. I messaged him, I said that when your retirement comes, I'm flying back to Guam for your retirement party, because I want to give a speech and tell everybody how much you impacted my life. And I can tell you, when I was young, when I first met him, I actually didn't like him at all. And if he hears this, he probably knows, because he's this really coarse, kind of tough,
everybody was, all the boys in the class were afraid of him, and he comes off as just really this strong kind of figure. But once I got to know him, I realized that he's being tough on us because he wants us to be better. You know what I mean? Then over the years, just spending time with him, and make a long story short, I ended up building a classic car, like a hot rod in the class, we made it our class project, and he guided me through the whole step from beginning until the end. And it took about a year and a half to complete that project, and it was like weekends and after school hours. So I spent a lot of time in that shop class, and he was always just there, kind of guiding me. He didn't do it for me, but he showed me what I needed to do, and what I learned from him. The reason why I say that, the part of the reason I am who I am today is because of him, and some of the other strong figures I had growing up, was because he taught me that when you have, if you wanna achieve something big, you gotta break it down into small parts, and take it one step at a time, and just keep working, and just being persistent, and keep working towards that. And that's what I learned, because the thought of building a car from the ground up, from scratch, really. It's overwhelming. It's overwhelming when you're 15 years old, you know what I mean? I didn't even know where to start, you know what I mean? But he broke it down. He was like, you do this, and then you're gonna do this, and eventually you're gonna get here, and then you're gonna get there, and then that was actually my high school senior ride. I drove that hot rod every day. It was my daily driver. And entered in a car show, won first place, and it was beautiful. Wow, with the car you built? Car that I built, yeah, 1932 Ford, yeah. Man, there's a lot of elements of masculinity in there, man. That was the lesson that I learned. So going back to the mentors, I think exactly what you're saying, that boys growing up, especially today,
they really, really would benefit from having a strong mentor, and something that they're interested in, you know what I mean? So if you kind of force somebody upon them, say, hey, this guy will teach you this, and they're not even interested in whatever he's gonna teach, it's not gonna work. But if they have the drive and the interest, and they find somebody that can kind of take them under their wing, then that's the best thing you can do. You know, that's deep that you're saying that, because how old are you? 44. 44. You see, that's why we do different demographics of people, because you're gonna come with some type of experience that started with knowledge that you'll be able to relate now, because what you're saying is priceless, right? You wouldn't expect someone of a younger age demographic to say something like that in that way, you know? And that's why when talking about, you know, you mentioned your father, and helping build the masjid, then this mentor you had, how would you see that with tying in with your purpose of life? Because when we see the purpose of life, you know, as Muslims, for me, it was really when I actually decided to become a Muslim. Like, the fact that I decided to become a Muslim, that's where the connection came in. It was like, okay, everything I do in this life is to show gratitude to Allah. The most important thing is that I have the right intention, because the intention will make it or break it. You know what I'm saying? So if I'm going to school, because after I became a Muslim is when I decided to go to community college. If I wouldn't have been that, I would've just been in the street doing wild stuff. So that was the transition for me, and it was that belief in God that pushed me to do the quote-unquote right thing. And a lot of people have recent, I know we were shooting the breeze earlier. We're talking about recently, a lot of people with high caliber accomplishments, achievers in the sports world, per se, have entered in the fold of Islam. And we were talking about why was that? Right, right, right. What was that all about? Why do you guys feel that was part of the reason? Well, you know, again, I mean,
sometimes it takes somebody inspiring that people, they want to emulate that. So we talked about Habib, you know, like how he inspired the whole MMA world and the whole world altogether, you know what I mean? And then a lot of young fighters saw the success that he had, saw how humble he was in achieving it, and said, I want to be like that guy. I don't want to be like that arrogant other guy that's, you know, running all over the ring and this and that. And that's the first step. So even if you can't have a mentor, like a physical mentor in your life, having a role model, right, to emulate is really part of the thing. But the second thing I'll say that really, you learn from being around older men is that you learn confidence. You know, confidence is key. You know, I'm able to do a lot of the things that I do today is because I have confidence. And that confidence started growing around that age. You know, I- High school? Yeah, high school. I started doing things. Then I realized that, you know, I'm doing something that all the other kids in my school aren't doing. I'm building my own car. I'm driving something that nobody else can drive. And that gave me confidence. And then those skills necessarily didn't translate to a lot of other things I did, but the confidence did. Let me ask you this, though. Let me ask you this. When you were making the car, when you started making the car, you were hanging around this mean teacher that a lot of the guys didn't like. Yeah. Were you, like, being made fun of, like you were Noah building the ark? Oh, 100%. 100%. I got called brown-noser. I got called all that kind of- Teacher's pet. Teacher's pet. The whole shebang. Because, you know, like, he rewarded hard work, right? That's how my teacher was. Yeah, okay. And the way, just to tell you how our class structure was, there's three years to graduate from this community college program of, like, automotive, you know, whatever. And only the seniors, they get to paint. And when you're a young boy, it's all about paint. You want to be the one laying down the finish on the car, you know, putting the graphics on, all that kind of stuff.
But the top of the shop is the only guy that's allowed in the paint booth, right? So I was, like, I was a first year, right? But everybody else was goofing off. I was busting my tail in there, you know, standing, doing all the grunt work and all that kind of stuff. And one day, the shop, my shop teacher, Mr. Todala, he was so mad at the top of the shop. We all had nicknames, by the way. So his name was Joe Bondo, right? Joe Bondo. He got so mad at Joe Bondo, he said, you're not painting today. He said, Abawi, get into the booth, you're gonna paint. Mine was the Rodfather. I was the Rodfather, yeah, yeah. So I started painting, and that, like, everybody was instantly mad at me. Passive. Yeah, right. Oh, how come you let, oh, how come your brown nose, or this and that. But you know what? As, you know, I just, it built my confidence. It built my confidence. At a younger age. At a young age. And that's why going into college, you know, coming from Guam to Nebraska, you know, which is a huge culture shock, right? And then just, you know, all those kind of things. It just, you go in with that confidence, and I think that's what's lacking today. And you played D1 sports, too, right? I played rugby, yeah, for the University of Nebraska. Again, these are all things that kind of build you up, right, you know, you're in the gym, you're training, you're playing rugby, it's a tough sport, you know what I mean? And you feel and act tough because you are tough. And you're a jock walking around, too. That's right. That's what they call it. But this one, like, for you, Willie, I mean, you're a relationship guy, man. Everybody, that should be like a t-shirt for you. Everybody knows Waleed. Like, everybody, everybody knows Governor. But then Raymond's gonna get jealous. We gotta give you another one, man. Everybody loves Raymond, they just scratch it off. Good with Governor Waleed. I hope. So, like, with you, I mean, for, you know, we're talking about, you know, the fact that you know a lot of people. You had to gain a level of confidence, because I'm almost sure people turned you down. But how did you, for instance, with what Allah has given you, the skill of being able to get in a room,
to talk to people, to make business deals, make things happen, how did you, when did it impact you? And you said to yourself, you know what? I wanna live my life doing this. This is how I wanna worship Allah, via this. You know, actually, alhamdulillah, I think it started early on with just establishing the core foundation of our faith, which is our prayers, our salah. And when I was playing varsity sports in high school, I knew that I had to separate myself from the boys to the men, which, you know, because now we hit puberty, and now we have to start making salah. And at that time, at 13 years old, you know, which is like sort of that, the golden age to usually for puberty, I felt, subhanAllah, that I had to start, if I wanted to be treated and accepted, you know, as a Muslim and whatnot, and to be confident about it, I had to actually act upon it. And alhamdulillah, I established that early on. And then from 13 years old now, and what, just turned 39, alhamdulillah, I kept the foundation of the salah. And actually, the core of the salah just kept me in sync, because irrespective of whatever we did, whether it be, you know, we try to keep ourselves out of haram and whatnot, but, you know, that always reminded us to go back and revert back to our core principle, our faith. Because I remember, man, when I wasn't Muslim, you know, in high school, you see those Muslim names, I didn't know they were Muslim names, and they, you know, they weren't active Muslim, let's just say that. Yeah. Both of y'all were born Muslim, correct? I don't know. So the transition for you was sports, but what was it that made you say, you know what, I wanna pray because this is how I want to be, okay, in that time, what were you saying to yourself? So interesting enough, I was living in the town, when we all know the tragic episode of the September 11th. So I lived in the town where the most casualties
of 9-11 happened, which is called Middletown, New Jersey. That's the high school I went to. And we actually got documented. You know, the school, we were the only, one of the only Muslim families in the whole entire school. There was over 2000 students in our high school. My brother and I, I was a senior at the time, and he was a junior when it happened. And they came and they actually documented our family. Okay. That, you know, in terms of a Muslim family living post 9-11. And actually we had a camera crew, a photographer, a book writer that came and followed us and wanted to actually portray the proper image of what a Muslim family looks like. It actually boosted our confidence in what we're doing and how we're living as a Muslim. And fast forward, you know, the book was completed and they wrote a whole chapter on our family. And I felt like at this point, I can't be, I have to practice what I preach. And it wasn't easy. And I remember that the moment that September 11th happened and I was in the high school, I got a call because we used to have those two-way Nextel phones. So the principal actually, she bleeped me on the phone and she goes, Waleed, come down to my office. That was my relationship with my principal. Okay. She had my cell phone and she would call me. Wow. You got in that much trouble, okay. No, we got in that much trouble. Hey. Come on, man. You can say trouble, I can say something else. You're a Muslim man, you gotta be honest. Well, I was involved with so much. Most schools, school spirited, varsity sports, senior council, you know, business leaders. Weren't you like homecoming queen or king? I'm sorry, not queen. I hope there was no king. I said king. That happened in college. That was a little funny. We gotta talk about, we gotta build a foundation. That's right, that's right. No, but subhanAllah, she actually came and she said to us, because of the work we put forward, you know how you say pay it forward? This is exactly it.
She said to us, and she was a sweet heart, sweet Irish lady, and she said, listen, whatever happened, you know, happened, this has nothing to do with you guys, right? This is just some crazy scenario that took place. We know who you are as Muslims. We know you guys are good people. We know you guys are good in the school. You guys have been here for many years. We all graduated from there, all my siblings, and my mom taught there as well at the school. So walk around with hijab in an all predominantly white neighborhood, white town, and very blue collar and white collar as well. But we actually put it forward. We weren't ever the ones getting in trouble, right? So when they saw that, they were like, they accepted the Muslims for who they are because they knew them. And my mom was being around and always coming, and she always came with her trays of baklava to the school, and they loved her so much because this is genuinely who we were. It wasn't, we had to make up for it later on. So at that point, so I guess you can say September 11th was a catalyst for you to really think about, what I do is a way of showing gratitude to Allah and how I live out that purpose, right? Because not a lot of people could experience that because we lived literally right across the water from when it happened. So as a man now, all of us here are fathers. Alhamdulillah. Yeah, I'm a father of four. Waleed, how many children do you have? Alhamdulillah, we have five. Allahu akbar, masha'Allah. Same, five. Five, masha'Allah. So well over three children, we each have well over three children. Being a father, man, like being a father and each moment that you mentioned and that you mentioned from your mentor, building a masjid with your father and then your teacher as a mentor and having go through the blood, sweat and tears, you know what I'm saying? And then also September 11th, having that as a catalyst, you know, to really think about what life is about. Like I said, when I became a Muslim, the question I asked myself was, what is life really about?
I'll never forget, I watched that Khalid Yassin tape, What's the Purpose of Life? I was just thinking about him right now. That was it for me. That was really when I said, the purpose of life goes back to God. It doesn't go back to my profession, you know, what I've attained in life, my accolades, my reputation, it goes back to God. And that I think for a man is crucial. Yes, absolutely. And actually fast forward real quick. So finished high school, college, and you talk about the purpose of life. At 20 years old, I proposed to my wife in marriage. Masha'Allah, okay. Of course, through her father, which she had no clue about it, because we were in the MSA, as everybody knows these MSAs in the college, we went to serve, served on the MSA together. Wait, wait, wait, what's the MSA for? Marriage Association, yes. That's the first time I heard that. It is. Really? That's what it converted to. Come on, man, where you been? That's the first time I heard that. Actually, I know, and actually, I know about 10 couples that got married internal through the MSA. I'm not mad at that, man. That was the best, those were the golden years. Yes. And I proposed to her at a young age, why? SubhanAllah, I was 20 years old. I didn't have a nickel to my name, but I wanted to fast forward. I wanted, because I was learning so much to talk about mentorship. I saw a lot of people that have advanced their lives. Being around good people. Okay. And Alhamdulillah, when I went ahead and made that decision to propose to her for marriage, and she was senior to me as well, I felt this is a time I needed to settle down with my life at a young age because there's so much fitna out there. Yeah. So about manhood, and I want to protect my manhood. I want to protect my family and everything else. And I felt this was the right approach. And subhanAllah, since that, every single one of my siblings, they followed suit. Mashallah. Like my own brother-in-law met my, or saw my sister on the day of my wedding, and he wanted to propose to her in marriage. And a couple months later, they did and Alhamdulillah, 15 years later, strong, and they also have their five kids. That was from the day of the wedding. Yeah, yeah.
And also my other brother and then my other. So all this circulated into a good, something good came out of it. Yeah, yeah. Because I put it forward. I didn't want to wait. And I felt, I see all the brothers that start at an early age to really establish themselves and to start developing themselves as a, from a boy to a man. You gotta, you can't just talk about it. Well, I mean, Waleed, one of the things that you said is really key. I mean, the thing that, if you ask me what the issue is with our young men today, is that they're kind of trapped in this perpetual boyhood. You know what I mean? Like you see these 25, even 30 year olds, and they're still doing the same thing that, you know, we were doing when we were 16 years old, you know what I mean? Playing video games and, you know, hanging out, no responsibility. And a couple of things that you mentioned are key. I also got married very young. I think I was 21 years old. I've been married for 22 years or whatever now. Better get that number right. Yeah, for the record, get it right here for the record. What were some of the key things that could propel somebody to become who they are or whatever? Marriage is one of them, you know what I mean? And I tell my kids, I have, I mean, one of my daughters in college, my son's senior in high school, tell them the same thing. I said, listen, get married young, get married young. You don't have to be financially independent on your own and have a job and have a degree. And then you get married, just get married and go through life's journey together. It's like struggle together. And that will make you stronger as a couple in the future. And that's the beautiful thing about the struggle, right? Because when you struggle as a young, vibrant man that is learning how to protect themselves on his way to study, to eventually provide. He's going to learn, OK, before I graduate, I need to start thinking about providing now. That's right.
Not only rely on the degree, but rely on soft skills that I can attain, you know what I'm saying? To be able to protect, because this woman I want to marry, and that's what I'm going to ask you. I remember a mentor of mine, he said, man, when I asked the girl that I married, why do you want to get married? She said, I want a partner to help me to get to general. That's it. Everything else is just a way that I do that. And those ways need to be halal, you know what I'm saying? So like when you're talking about getting married young, it's very, very important. And it's good to hear a father say that, you know, in 2024, man, because, you know, you'll find it. I was thinking the other day, you know, a guy graduates at the age of 17, 18, right? Goes to college at least four years. Yes, that's 21. And if he goes to med school, you're talking about another seven on top of that. That's when you should start thinking about marriage. And that's actually sometimes they do. Yeah. And actually, sometimes you've already like passed those happy years. Not necessarily, but you missed a lot of opportunity. My wife, mind you, she, when SubhanAllah, I'll show you how amazing she is. When I approached her in marriage, for marriage, she actually came and approached me and she walked right up to me on the college campus and she said, I got a question for you. She goes, why do you want to marry me? And of course, at that time, either you'd be Rico Suave or you'd be like the Nabi Sallallahu Alaihi Wasallam, right? So I was like, I got to fix, I got to, you know, fast forward a little bit. So I said to her, I said, because I look at you as the mother of my children, you know, and it was nothing else more than that. And I said, and I asked her, I said, where do you stand, you know, in terms of your career or your family and whatnot? She goes, listen, I'm in med school, but my family comes first. That put me at ease. And Mashallah, she's very successful. She's a she's a practicing family doctor. But she had three. We had three kids during her residency. Yeah, man. See, this is what I'm talking about. You guys also had, you too? Yeah. So my wife's also a physician, and we had our first one in medical school
and then second one in internship, which was, yeah, it was very difficult. No, but see, this is this is very important in regards to this is even considered a rite of passage as well, because you're growing as a man, going through hardships with the mother of your children, with your wife. And that only made us better. And it only makes you strong. You're still here in your life. Sometimes people think that, you know, once you go through this, it's going to be a trial and a tribulation that will be heavily traumatic. Yes. So after, you know, it's funny. It's my college professor. I got married when I was still an undergraduate. It was summer of my junior year, I believe. And we had we were taking this ethics class. We needed it to graduate, both my wife and I. And the professor, I'll never forget him. He told me he said, listen, you guys are really nice people. He said, my advice, don't get married. And I said, why? He said, because statistically over 50 percent of people will get divorced by the time they graduate medical school. People who go in married to medical school, over 50 percent will end up divorced because of the stress of being in medical school and stuff like that. And I told him, I said, you know, professor, I said, respectfully, I think we're different. You know, he says, yeah, that's what they all say. And alhamdulillah, I know what I meant was we're different is that we're Muslim. You know what I mean? And even though those those years we were dirt poor, we had nothing. Still had to depend on my parents to help out every once in a while and things like that. But I'll tell you what, Sheikh, it was the happiest years of my life. Not that I'm not happy now. Alhamdulillah, Allah has blessed me with five beautiful children. If you're listening, I love you guys a lot. But but, you know, just that the foundation that was set for those children. Absolutely. You know, those times, those struggles, the we used to go camping and, you know, on our breaks and just all the things that we used to do. I mean, it made us who we are today. Nassim, Alhamdulillah, that even reminds me. I totally forgot when I went to surgical tech school, you know, I became a Muslim around that time.
And I remember, you know, I was growing my beard out. And she was like, I don't know how you're going to do this. You know, you're going to be going in the OR. And, you know, I said, well, there's masks, there's appropriate masks that we can wear, you know, and I trust in God. You know, this is who I trust in the most. And he's the one that's going to give me this job or take it away. Right. And she was like a very she was very Methodist. She was a strong Methodist. So she heard that she backed off and left me alone. Yeah. And the second incident is when I graduated and I found a job as a surgical tech and I had the opportunity to make hajj. And it was during my two week, my three month evaluation, three month orientation. Yeah. So I walked down there for you and I walked in. I told Shirley, her name was Shirley Taylor. I walked in and said, Shirley, I know this is going to be difficult, but, you know, I'm a Muslim, as you know. And there's something called hajj, you know, it's a pilgrimage. And I've been given the opportunity. All expenses paid. All expenses paid. Right. Yeah. To go to go and brother, you know what happened? She said, oh, my God, really? My husband is a historian. She showed me, she showed me a picture of the Kaaba. It was in her office. Allahu Akbar. And she said, yeah, look, we'll make something. I know it's religious. You're God will make something happen. Don't worry, we'll have somebody coming for you. Purpose, man. Like everything goes back to that. When you trust in, that's what I mean by the purpose. Like everything you're talking about. And this is very common. Medical school. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I got a lot of phone calls from brothers, by the way, before they marry a sister in med school. They said, what should I do? I said, support her. Give her the give her the the emotional, physical and the mental support because they're going to need all that because it's very stressful. You guys did it both together. Yeah. I applaud you guys for that. No, Alhamdulillah. Alhamdulillah. And Alhamdulillah. And a lot of brothers, once they take the advice, they appreciate it. Those hardships, man. It's not easy. It makes a man out of you. It makes a man out of you. And sometimes, by the way, mind you, as as scary as as as it sounds that you have no clue what's going to happen.
Well, I just put in the trust in Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala. I never it was never a dull moment. We've never worried, actually, because we always knew our intentions were pure. But we at the same time did it. You know, we did always istikhara and istishara. Istishara with the shura, the people that you love. Seeking counsel from people. Absolutely, because that's a big point that people don't know. And that's another aspect of responsibility, man. Because once you're you always have your ultimate intention is to do it for Allah. So you're seeking advice. That takes a lot of humility. Yes, big time. It takes a lot of knowing the right people because it's going to be something. And trusting. Yeah. Whoever you talk to, you're trusting them. But we know as men, we don't want to be vulnerable, man. No. We want to look weak, right? It says being weak. Yeah. What's weak about asking Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala, Ya Rabb? You know, guide me, help me, support me. And then you go to your friends, your beloved brothers that you love. Like I have two in front of me. Say, I need to talk to you about something. And you know what's deep? You go to Allah first, istikhara, right? And then you go to the ones that you feel Allah has gifted to give you that advice. Yeah, Allah. You know what I'm saying? And that's what makes a man out of you, man. And that whole process, I think that's really what distinguishes the Muslim man out of everyone else. When we're talking about the purpose of life and that purpose being something that goes beyond, it's transcendent. Yes. You know what I mean? So talking about family, I like that you mentioned that, man, because, you know, when I looked to get married, too, I didn't have any money. I was a miskeen student. Welcome to the club, brother. The miskeen club. I was miskeen. I think I was the founder of that club. It was good. I had money left over from surgical tech. But the first, second year, there's books in the heart of them. I'm like, man, come on, this money. By the time I found somebody, you know, I didn't have any money, man. Don't worry about it. When I was going to propose to my wife, I parked my car around the corner. That's how miskeen I was. The car probably made it. I rode my bicycle over. What are you talking about? It was a $75 car my brother gave me. Big ups to my brother.
Yeah. He gave me a car because I couldn't afford it. It was a $75 car. And he said, use this. I used it for six months until it completely died. But Wallahi, the barakah that was put in that. Yeah, that's funny you mention that. I think all of us have car stories, man. Even when you say free, I'd rather take one free that say $75. One of the things that you mentioned, though, is you said purpose. Yeah. And I think another thing that I think I've identified a lot with people when they're not happy, it's because they're trying to find purpose in the wrong thing, you know, and I see it a lot as physicians, right? So a lot of people, their identity revolves for doctors, their identity revolves around being a doctor. So they get their sense of purpose and fulfillment from being a physician. Right. But the reality is being being a physician is really not that glamorous. You know, we have to deal with a lot of stuff, especially in the emergency department. After a while, that novelty wears off and those people end up happy, which is why a lot of physicians are, you know, the suicide rate amongst physicians is extremely high. Yes. So my point is, is that, you know, whatever it is that you do, if you're trying to find purpose in something other than through your deen and your connection with Allah SWT, eventually the novelty will wear off and it'll get old and you'll be unhappy. This is what I'm doing some research on, man. There's a book called Man's Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl. He's a psychologist of the past, and he was in the concentration camps. You know, he lived in the concentration camps and he realized that people, once they lost a lot of their belongings, their loved ones, what is life about them in a concentration camp? Some got suicidal. Some felt that life had no meaning. Life had nothing. Nothing was worth worth anything. But he said, really, the goal of man is to find meaning.
Right. Once he finds meaning, he finds relevance. And once he finds relevance, that's where any he'll he'll overcome any triumph. All right. Right. Right. But I was like, this is deficient in some way, because exactly what you're saying is, you know, subhanAllah, you know, unfortunately, qadrullah, that you'll find Muslims even find their validation in their profession. And then the position is that one of the most noblest professions, mashaAllah, it's a radical law on the mainstream, right? Being a physician and if they find stress in it, they might question that because, you know, is it really worth it? Yeah. So I came to a conclusion. That there's the meaning in life and there's the meaning of life. Right. So the meaning in life that we find people saying, I'm finding meaning in this, that's finding fulfillment in something you do. I find fulfillment in being a physician and helping people get to their optimal health. Right. Or in the emergency room, somebody comes with a gunshot wound. I want to be that person that Allah uses to help this person. That's meaning in life. You find fulfillment. Somebody may not find fulfillment. How many people have you met? The first sight of blood, they faint. You've probably seen this in some medical school. I've seen it when I was a surgical tech. They see blood, they faint. They're like, yeah, I don't think this is for me. That's going to be a long road for them. You're not cut out for this. Right. You don't find, but they may find meaning in being a first grade teacher and teaching a child how to read. Right. Right. You know what I'm saying? And that's, yeah. But it's deficient though. So someone that doesn't have their purpose in life, they say, I want to, I was, I was, I'll never forget. I was learning how to, I was, uh, went to a TESOL school, like to teach English as a second language because it was a long story. So I was trying to bring my wife from overseas and I had to learn, teach English so I could stay with her. You know, when I was getting my e-comm and stuff like that. So I was in a Tribeca, right? Tribeca, learn how to teach English. Second language. I met this girl, man. She was in our class. She was from Tennessee and she was learning how to teach English for what reason, bro. She went there to just learn, teaching us to go to Uganda to teach the kids English.
That was her lifelong mission. But her lifelong mission was to do that. And that was in the name of religion, right? Of course it was a missionary. The missionary. Exactly. So that's, you'll find people that will do it, but it's for a reason. Their purpose. That was their purpose though. Right. But you'll find people that are not even, they're religious, but they only do it for a monetary gain, for personal fulfillment. But the connection with the Muslim is that I do that. And that's my way that I worship Allah. The meaning of life. And that's what you mean by purpose. So, you know, that's what I see in society in general, put the Muslims to the side. We see this phenomenon all more and more, especially amongst the millennials. You know what I mean? Is that everybody is searching for purpose and they feel like they're going to find it before it was save the whales or save the polar bears or whatever. Then it was personal fulfillment. I'm going to climb Kilimanjaro. I'm going to dive the deepest ocean, whatever it was, or run a marathon or become a triathlete because, and so you will find temporary purpose in these kinds of things. But as soon as it's done, you realize it's empty and then you try to go on to the next thing, but eventually you're going to run out of that. And it's going to be, it's going to be all in vain, right? For, I'll just be honest about myself. You know, I don't want people to get the impression that I, yes, I was born Muslim. Alhamdulillah. I come from a family that we used to pray all together and things like that. But I didn't, if you ask me, when did I really realize the gift of Islam? And it wasn't until I was probably 35, 36 years old. I was just like these people that I'm describing right now. I was building cars, buying properties, doing stuff, trying to go on these kinds of trips and this and that. I thought that I could find happiness through that. But you know, the turning point in my life was when my father, Allah, he passed away. I was really, really close with my dad. He lived with us.
I didn't have any brothers. He was like my father and my brother. So we did everything together. And then when he died at a young age, relatively young age, you know, just kind of more suddenly, I realized what is the, what am I, what am I doing? What am I doing? I'm a doctor. Sure. I have money. Yes. I have this. I went on this vacation. Great. But am I happy? And I wasn't, you know what I mean? So then I honestly, I had to go on this personal journey myself to really, I wanted to know for sure that Islam was the right religion. And I couldn't do that until I investigated all the other ones. So I went on like this two year journey. My wife remembers where I started studying all the other religions and deep dives with a real open mind and this and that. And then eventually I said, okay, well let me like learn more about my religion, you know? And then when I, when I started doing that, then I said, SubhanAllah, man, I had it all along and now, now I finally realized it. Right. So then my, my life started having purpose, right? I could still be a physician, but I knew that that's not the source of my happiness. It's one of the things that if I do it with the right intention inshallah, it'll bring me closer to Allah SubhanAllah. And then everything else that branched out from that raising family, having children, you know, and things like that, it all branches from wanting to be closer from Allah. But for me, it came to me later in life. You know what I mean? It sounds like for you, Alhamdulillah, it came when you were younger. And actually part of your, you're mentioning like the, what really solidified a lot of stuff is that I actually, to your point, exactly is that I started my, you know, a lot of people, they get, they retire, then they start doing charity and philanthropy work. Okay. I did the complete opposite. I finished business. I graduated from business school and I had a choice to either go to the charity world or to go through the corporate world. And that's when I started working for Islamically at a very young age.
I was there for 17 years up until recent, right? Which I started working on some new initiatives and collaborations. I wanted to sort of finish in what I'm doing, finish in the world of philanthropy, finish in the world of sadaqah and giving back and serving. And I think the purpose to me, that's just my, my personal definition of a purpose is serving Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala in whatever shape or form. So, and I, going back to the purpose, that's where I feel, you know, our purpose should be. Find whatever door that will allow you to enter into the Jannah. And that's exactly what Imam Maliki said. Everyone has their doors that they, when they asked him, when he didn't go and fight, right? Because he was always, he was in Medina. Yeah. But he mentioned something along those lines that everyone has their doors and their pathway and choose what Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala does. As Prophet sallallahu alaihi wa sallam said, he said, do work for everyone. That ease of facilitation has been made for what they've been created for. So Allah has created you with a certain interest in something, go at it. And we, as fathers, you know, it's our duty for our, our ra'iyah. You know, as Prophet sallallahu alaihi wa sallam said, he said, all of you are shepherds. And you'll be asked about your, your, your flock to facilitate our children to live their purpose. You know, and that's why, you know, not every child has to go into ta'feeh of the Quran. Yeah. Yeah. Right. This child may be gifted with it and that's how they fulfill it, you know? And then this one may not in regards to memorization, but in other ways of the most important thing is that they live the Quran in their lives. And we, as fathers, that's our ultimate responsibility. Just today alone, I was talking to my son, Hamza. He's 10 years old. My eldest boy, my eldest is Maryam, my daughter. She's 12. And subhanAllah, I was talking about two things today. I spoke to him about, about him pursuing hifz. You know, mashaAllah, I know your kids, mashaAllah already got to there. So you guys are my mentors. They're my inspiration for that. And I told him, Hamza, if this is something you want to do, I fully support you.
And I don't want you to be pressured to doing it. I want you to love it, enjoy it, live it. So you can, you know, breed it. You know, I think honestly, Waleed, what I've noticed with my kids is that, and just myself growing up, I'm sure you all kind of felt the same way, but we innately just, we want to please our parents, right? You know what I mean? We want them to feel, we want our parents to feel, to look at us and say, Oh, good job, my son. You know what I mean? Like feel proud of us, right? That's in the end of the day, that's what we all want, right? You know, when it comes to our relationship with our parents. So what it is that you value in your life, your children are going to also learn to value those kinds of things. You know what I mean? So I think, you know, for families and for young boys and young girls and things like that, just giving them a good example, giving them, being, showing them the right way that a husband and wife interact, you know, in the home. You know, that's really, really important. That's the best, you know, teaching, because the reality is they're going to revert to whatever it is that they saw growing up. Exactly. And my parents, well, I, growing up, because I was one of five children, the middle boy, middle child, anytime my father and my mother had a dispute, anytime, they would go up, they would go to the room, close the door, they'll speak their mind to each other, and they'll come out like nothing ever happened. Yeah, yeah. Well, in the respect that my father gave my mother, you know, so many, for so many years up until today, you know, mashallah, and may Allah preserve them and be pleased with them. And we were talking about like a part of our inspiration too, right? That was my inspiration to how I wanted to have my family. My wife, alhamdulillah, you know, we have a great relationship, and may Allah preserve that relationship and make it better. You know, and part of that is I always remind my children, whenever they're yelling and fighting and beating each other up, and the way, whatever they do, I said, do you see me doing that to your mother? Yeah. And automatically, they say no.
Yeah, and myself as a public speaker, you know, sometimes I'll catch myself speaking to my son one time and I caught him so bad. I'm talking, I think after a basketball game, I've changed my way when talking about basketball, because I don't want to get in the car and I usually say, okay, second quarter, man, why did you do a turnaround? You just should have went up with the, you know, now I'm quiet, and then he'll open up. But before, I remember one time I was doing it, and it was from Allah. Well, Allah, it was from Allah. Everything's from Allah, but this one, like Allah was like, shut up. So I was talking, and I just, I was driving, I said, I said, man, am I giving you a khutbah right now? And he looked at me, he's like, yeah, Baba, you're giving me a khutbah. That's it, man. SubhanAllah, you know what I'm saying? Well, like recently, I've been trying to change my approach with my kids. Like my son, Hamza, he is the type of person that does not like to be yelled at or barked at. And guess what? He shuts down. So my wife would take him, and she'll talk to him very casually, nice, soft, smooth. And I was like, I could do that too. I could be the, we want to be the man of the household and yell and bark, and khalas. But at the same time, I could also come down. The Nabi, salallahu alayhi wa sallam, was so good to how he connected with so many people. You asked him earlier, how do I, the connection, connecting with people. That's because sometimes you gotta read people and talk to them on their level. You know, whatever comes from the heart reaches the heart. You know, and I really think that's something I'm learning as well. You know, it's trial and error. That's what fatherhood is all about, marriage. That's it, bro, that's it. And that's why it's just so deep. And that's why, you know, we're going back to purpose and reason. When your ultimate purpose for that person, that coworker, is for them ultimately to recognize Allah and become Muslim. And if they are Muslim, it's like, okay, to bring them back to Allah. Not saying that I'm better than you, but I see something that I would want someone to tell me. You know what I'm saying? That's why this is the first theme
for all of these episodes is because this is the foundation. We need it. When you have this foundation, everything is exemplified and shown through this keeping this in mind. Like I have this purpose and therefore I'm going to talk to the person this way. And that's why we see within the Sunnah of the Prophet, sallallahu alayhi wa sallam. Like these hadith that we're mentioning and how you deal with people and how a man should be versus a woman. And you know, it was interesting when I was at this conference, a brother, I gave a lecture on male roles and female roles, right? So I said, I like to use the word roles. I like to use guidelines with objectives, right? These are guidelines that have ultimate godly objectives, not cultural, it's godly. It's not ours, it's what was scripted for us. Exactly, man. So he came, he said, man, I like the lecture. He said, I like what you said about, you know, re-owning the term housewife, for example. I think we as Muslims, we need to own that term. It's not a derogatory term. It's a very lofty honorable term. But he said something so deep. He said, man, he said, my father came to my wife and told my wife, you know, when the Prophet, sallallahu alayhi wa sallam said that Jannah lies at the feet of the mother. He said, you have to earn that. He said, you have to earn being called a mother. It's earned. That is not like, and the same thing with the father, too. And so we find this verse, ar-rijalu qawwamun ala l-insan. It's controversial. I always say, okay, I speak to the men first. I don't talk about, okay, the man has authority over you, this and this and that. I say, look, first be a rajul, and you will naturally be qa'im. The woman will naturally want to follow you when she sees and knows that you're a rajul. And that's why Allah, it's a khabariya. He's saying, this is what it is, ar-rijalu qawwamun ala l-insan. You can't change that, but you have to be that. And that was scripted. That's in our scripture that we follow, that we accept. But we have to live it. We have to learn it. We have to apply it in life. Part of that, though, Waleed, I think, you know, is we have to let go of two different things. Number one is the old notions from back home.
You know, father doesn't hug the children. He's the tough guy. He just goes and works hard, earns the money, brings it home. Woman, where is my dinner? You know, like that kind of. The halal bacon, though. Right, yeah, that's right, halal bacon. Shout out to my boys, the halal bacon. That's something we gotta let go of. But then we also have to let go of this new age kind of, oh, it's a 50-50, you know. Partnering. Yeah, you wash the dishes one night and I'll wash the dishes the other night. And then we're equal, but we're, no. We have to let go of both sides. Because I think that over the last 15, 20 years since we were, what, high school, middle school, I mean, we've been kind of slowly conditioned into believing, we were both raised in, all of us were raised in the United States, I mean, conditioned to believe that men, or dads, are the doofus, you know, Homer Simpson, Al Bundy, you know, like, and the wife is the brilliant, intelligent one that holds everything together, and the father is a bumbling idiot, you know what I mean? So this is what society has projected upon us, which is probably why our men are in the state that they're in. So there's a balance in between, right? The balance in between is, yes, men are the caretakers of women, but that also comes with the responsibilities. But it's beautiful what you're talking about, because the hadith of the Prophet, where he said, laisa shadidu bisra, and that the harsh one is not the one that can wrestle, he debunks it, Iman. Yeah, yeah, yeah, subhanAllah. He said, the one that is harsh, the one that is the shadid is the one that can control themselves in times of anger. He doesn't discredit anger. Because if you're not angry about what's going on in ghazib, what's up? The Prophet, peace be upon him, he said, man lam yuhaddith nafsahu bil ghazu. You know, the one that doesn't speak about ghazu in his heart. Like there has to be some level of battle that you have that you have to want in your heart. You know, that is important. So he doesn't deny the anger, but he says, you control it, don't let it control you. And just because you're a wrestler, not discounting the wrestling,
but don't think that that is what masculinity is. Don't think that that is what the shadid is. And he also said about the man that said, it's interesting you said that about the old-fashioned way. You know, the man came, he said, I have 11 children. I don't kiss any of them. Right. Right? Yeah, yeah. What did the Prophet say to me? He said, mal la yurham, la yurham. I love it, brother. He debunked it immediately. He's like, yo, no, no, no, that's not what I meant. Those who are not merciful too? Yeah. Those, yeah. Those who are not showing mercy to them? Are not showing mercy. No, so mashallah, may Allah bless you brothers for coming through, man. And that was a beautiful gathering, really understanding the importance of fatherhood, family, and how that is a way of living your purpose. May Allah make this a blessed gathering and make it a means of expiation for any shortcomings and make us the best men that he's created us to be. Ameen. BarakAllahu feekum. Wassalamualaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh.
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