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S1E6 - Has COVID Impacted My Faith? | DoubleTake
COVID-19 vaccines are becoming more available around the world, and people are starting to return to their places of work, recreation, and worship. However, life still feels far from normal for many of us. How have the lives of Muslims changed during the past year? What can we learn from the experiences of early Muslims who endured similar plagues?
Host Mohamad Zaoud explores these questions and more as he speaks to Dr. Rania Awaad, Research Fellow at Yaqeen Institute and lead author of the paper “Coping with Pandemics: Psychological and Spiritual Lessons from Islamic History.”
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This transcript was auto-generated using AI and may contain misspellings. COVID-19 vaccines are becoming more available around the world, and people are starting to return to their places of work, recreation and worship. But although we're returning to familiar places, life still feels far from normal for many of us. How have our lives changed during the past year? What have we learned? And what can we learn from the experiences of earlier Muslims who endured similar plagues? Welcome to Double Take, a podcast by Yaqeen Institute about questions and ideas around Islam and Muslims that give us pause. Remember to subscribe on Spotify, YouTube, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Mohammed Zahar and today on the show we're discussing some of the psychological and spiritual lessons we can take from the COVID experience. With me is Dr. Rania Awad, lead author of the paper, Coping with Pandemics, Psychological and Spiritual Lessons from Islamic History. Dr. Rania, assalamu alaykum and welcome to Double Take. Wa alaykum assalam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu. It's my pleasure to be here and an honour. Thank you, thank you so much for joining us. Dr. Rania, you're a clinical associate professor of psychiatry at Stanford, mashallah, and you're the director of the Muslim Mental Health and Islamic Psychology Lab. You also studied classical Islamic studies in Damascus and served as the first female professor of Islamic law at Zaytuna College, where you taught fiqh and Quranic sciences is my understanding. So I'm going to ask you a few questions about our lives, but I'd like to start off with one question that only you would be able to answer right from the outset. So my question to you is, how has the pandemic affected our psychological and spiritual well-being on an individual level? Bismillah ar-Rahman ar-Rahim, wa salatu wa sallam wa ala Sayyidina Muhammad wa ala alihi wa sahbihi wa sallam wa ajma'in. I think you're absolutely right about the psychological and spiritual well-being.
You know, subhanAllah, it's been a year, as you mentioned, and what a year it's been. And in the midst of this year, we actually have been very interested in trying to figure out exactly the same thing, because anecdotally and amongst ourselves, we all have our COVID stories. We all know and can tell you about how different life has been, how difficult life has been. And we also, subhanAllah, also had our share of stories either directly impacting ourselves and our family members, loved ones, community members, that have either had the COVID illness or actually have passed away from it, maalos patata grant, those people, jannah and ease and patience for their families. So it's been quite a year. And so when you think about psychologically and spiritually, how are we doing? The research studies that we've done actually in collaboration with Yaqeen and the Stanford Muslim and Islamic Psychology Lab, you know, has brought about such really interesting data. We thought as researchers that for sure, that given how difficult life has been before the pandemic, that when the pandemic hit, it would be that much harder. And although it has been, what's interesting is that spiritually speaking, there are many who are actually saying that this period of time has been a time of getting closer to Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala, a reminder. You know, that this very microscopic thing called the coronavirus that we can't even see, that put the whole world as a standstill, has actually made us stop and really reflect on Allah is in charge, that he is boss, capital B. And that he is, you know, he could put everything and just make the whole world as we know it kind of shift and come to a standstill, come to its knees, literally prayer wise, I mean, to say. And that's what we found. Our research has actually found that over 75 percent of Muslims say that in this last year, their faith or dependence on Allah has gotten stronger. Right. And that's a huge number. I'll tell you, in comparison to to non-Muslims, for example,
there are a few research study did a study where they looked at all faith groups and people of no faith in the US and they found the number is much higher than what they expected at 24 percent. But our number is more like 75 percent. Right. So there's something about Muslims and Islam, the resiliency this deem gives us, that has actually allowed us to cope better. You know, I'd love to I'd love to hear more about that, because, you know, Alhamdulillah, I think in some in some aspects of my life, anecdotally, as you mentioned, I feel like I've come closer to Allah. Yes, he's in control. And, you know, when I feel that I'm going to be challenged with earning a living during a COVID experience, that Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala somehow, you know, finds a way to to give me a rizq. But on the other hand, I've faced some challenges personally in maintaining my spirituality. Like I enjoyed the whole the whole idea of praying taraweeh at home. That was that was quite, you know, that was a blessing. It was spiritual. My family was together. But at the same time, my religiosity is probably linked to community service. And I wasn't able to go out there on the front lines and help and organize and and support as much as I'm used to. And I was recently reading an article in The Atlantic about how COVID has basically demolished many friendship circles. And for me, that's one of them. Like my friends have become a lot fewer. Like I've got, you know, deeper connections with fewer people. But that broad spectrum of Muslims that you see at the mosque or community activities has kind of disintegrated and it's affected my spirituality.
So do you mind just talking more to the to the research that you did? And is this just was a momentary spike in people's spirituality? Or are they going to be residual effects on on people's faith? I think that's it's really, really important. And as most researchers will tell you, this is room for more research to really figure out. What we did along with along with the clean is really look at three stages. You know, the first the first study actually came out right at the beginning within the first week of COVID. So March of 2020. And then there was a second, you know, pulse checking right where we kind of check the pulse again, right around, you know, pre Ramadan. Because there was always this fear of like, there'll be the very first Ramadan, as you mentioned, a different Ramadan than ones we've ever had before. And then again, a third pulse check in post Ramadan to see what would happen, what was it really like? And then there was a fourth one actually right around the summer when there was here in the US, there was a lot of tension of, you know, racial injustice and just all kinds of societal, historically societal issues that have really come came to a head over the summer. So we kind of pulse checked all throughout to see what was happening, and absolutely would want to continue checking that. So what I'm presenting to you is really data from, you know, about 9000 Muslims globally, throughout these different stages. And what we're finding is that even though yes, there is yes, there's more mental health concerns than before. Yes, there's more difficulty than before. Somehow, psychologically and spiritually, there is still this, again, compared to other faith groups, right, and compared to other groups of people, there's more kind of this connection with the divine.
And I can't help but imagine that this is something that is very indigenous to the Muslim faith, there is something about the resiliency building and the understanding of this life, this dunya that we're in is dar al balad, the world, the abode of tribulation, right? And that what's coming after this will be better. And so the kind of patience that we live through that sabroon jameel, that beautiful patience that we live through, even when it's difficult, even when things seem like they're crumbling, even like you mentioned job concerns and monetary financial concerns, all of these things, kind of understanding that if Allah sent us something difficult, He will send with it its ease, right? Inna ma'alousri yusra, right, that kind of concept. So yes, I don't want to oversimplify a very, very complex issue. But there's something very beautiful about the kind of resiliency that Islam gives us, I think. You were comparing us to other faiths, and you mentioned that, you know, we're at 75% of people feeling closer to God than those of other faiths, but there's, generally speaking, a net positive effect on spirituality, as I'm understanding from the research. Correct. That's absolutely right. I wanted to kind of draw just on Europe and America after World War One and Two. Based on kind of what I've read, I've seen just a general trajectory of people being less faithful or less spiritual after World War One and Two. Maybe that's because there were, you know, 100 million casualties. So from a psychological perspective, people probably lost faith in a God when it was two Christian groups, I guess, fighting each other in World War One at least.
And on a practical level, with less people out there doing community work, women having to look after their family, and without the nucleus of the family, husband and wife and kids, the Sunday church became less active. So physically, people were less religious, and mentally, people were less spiritual. Do we see the same thing in Islamic history with regards to pandemics? Or is this just unique to other faiths? I think these are really important questions. In fact, I would say that we were curious of the exact same thing. There was really the impetus for doing the study that we did that we published on pandemics in Islamic history was exactly to answer your question. Because, you know, this pandemic is definitely the one we are currently experiencing in modern history, but it's not the first. It's certainly not the first epidemic, and there have been many a plague in human history before this. So what did the people of old do? What did the people before us, our predecessors, the ones who, you know, clearly we derived from them, right? So what is it? And especially the Muslims, we're very curious, because Islamic history is, you know, kind of riddled with different plagues over time, and how do Muslims respond? And did they use Islamic spirituality in this or not? And I think that is a key difference, if you will, than maybe some of the reports that you were reading, which are very true, I want to say. That is reality. But where are the Muslims in the story? What were they doing? And what we found, and this is what the paper highlights, anecdotally, all kinds of stories in the history books of Muslims that talk about how they came together, and how sometimes when it was important to isolate, they isolated.
So there was kind of both happening. There was a coming together and an isolating, depending on the contagion or the issue that they were facing at the time. And as a society, right, there was this kind of like, we have to move forward. What you find in Islamic history related to the plagues is, you know, a lot of the same kind of verses and ayats of the Qur'an that we're hearing now in this year of the COVID-19 pandemic, urging us and reminding us that this is a test and tribulation from Allah, that ease will come after this. And also reminding us the importance of doing our civic duties and due diligence, right? Now, this year, it's all been about, you know, social distance and wash your hands frequently and sanitize and wear your masks and all of this. And there have been parallels to all of these things historically amongst Muslims as well. So and a lot of times the scholars are using Islamic principles or proofs to show how those things are important. So it's almost like, look, if you don't want to listen to your, you know, national or federal guidelines, listen to the Sunnah of the Prophet ﷺ, which is actually very intriguing and interesting. So it's almost like a parallel, almost like a repeating of certain things that have happened historically for the Muslims. So if we're going to use Ramadan specifically as just like a scenario, so we're saying spiritually, generally speaking, Muslims are closer to Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala during the pandemic. But there are a lot of aspects of Ramadan that are directly affected. Obviously, the prayers in the mosque and hopefully this year, things are getting better. But also the idea of charity and community service. And I know firsthand that the charity sector has been severely affected on two fronts.
One is the quality of projects is limited just because of logistical purposes, so people can no longer fly to certain areas where they can run projects. But also the whole idea of caring for other societies, caring for global causes. People are a little bit more self-centered without sounding negative because they're worried about their own financial situation, their own community situation. They're less worried about people overseas who are doing it tough. Have you seen anything in your research that suggests that it has a negative, the whole COVID experience has had a negative experience on charity work or on caring for society beyond your immediate circle? Well, I think definitely this is true in terms of the charity sector that there are, I would say, the traditional classical ways of fundraising and of contributing charitably has been affected. I do agree with that very much. I do also wonder, though, if like many other things that have happened with COVID, it opened up our eyes to different ways of doing things or kind of shifting the way. Because that's how I would like to see this as much as possible is, in all of this and in all of the COVID experience, what kind of messaging is the Loss of Pounds on is sending to us humans? Whether it be health and wealth or whether it be other aspects of our daily lives and wealth being one of those.
So when you think about charity, I have to say here that if I'm going to quote Imam Shafi, for example, if you'll allow me to, who is very particular when it comes to Zakat charity to give it locally or within a 50 mile radius of where you live and other opinions change. And Mashallah and Alhamdulillah for the mercy of the different opinions on how to give your Zakat. So as you know, can be given anywhere, but Zakat he was very particular about and I think about how something like this is really changed. It realigned it. I mean, Zakat has to be given regardless. But I wonder if what happens now, because his whole theory, Imam Shafi, was if you give it every person who owes Zakat, gives it within 50 miles of where they live, then every community is self sufficient and takes care of itself, essentially. And it's a ripple effect all the way out. And that was his theory and others agreed or disagreed with him. And when you think about what's happening with COVID, that sort of kind of organically happened that way, where a lot of the giving was kind of focused more locally than it was internationally. Interesting. It is very, very interesting, actually, SubhanAllah, how it just there's been like a movement, I think, in the last few years in Western societies where there's a bigger focus on local Zakat. And I, SubhanAllah, I think this has just sped that up and realigned our understanding of Zakat. I want to, before moving forward, I want to kind of go back to the idea of family and the effect the pandemic has had on family. Like, countless research has suggested that there's more pressures on family, I mean, due to financial reasons or just being stuck with the family in four walls for extended periods of time.
Have you seen in the research that this has had an adverse effect on Muslim marriages and Muslim families? Oh, it's definitely had a different effect for sure. And in many cases, yes, adverse. And there are specific cases, I'll tell you what I'm referring to, in situations where the household or the place where a person lived and who they were living with was already shaky in its foundations and already difficult or even abusive in its foundations. This has happened, you know, COVID has made it, the pandemic has made it so much worse, exponentially worse. You know, so the rates of domestic violence has really soared. So have the rates of divorce, interestingly enough, too, which sort of makes sense. It's almost like for divorce, it's like, you know, for some families, they had been, you know, couples and families, they sort of had been living like roommates, if you will. There wasn't really a strong family tie and connection. And when everyone had to quarantine and shelter at home, like you said, as you mentioned, the same four walls over and over again, the people said, I don't even really know this person. I had almost been like, you know, and our teacher, spiritual teachers warned us about having our marriages turn into like roommate situations and coming to face, almost like having to face the strained relationship in the marriage. And yes, that caused so many divorces to happen. And, you know, lack of, you know, lack of all kinds of things. You mentioned financial resources, but also just the homeschooling that people had to take on if they hadn't been ready or equipped to very suddenly, you know, the elder care and the constant worry of the health of all the different family members, especially if they were at distance from you and you couldn't get to them.
There were so many stressors and strains on people that it's almost like their bandwidth went shorter, and they couldn't handle kind of even what would have been everyday normal circumstances to handle, but quarantine made it that much more difficult to handle and shoulder. So we saw that with domestic life, if you will, and certainly with abusive situations, it has been very difficult and I really want to call attention to that because I think it's imperative to really understand what does that mean and how do we help folks that are in those situations. So yes, family life is really, the adverse part of it is very clear. There is also the positives where people were if they had healthy foundations, this potentially, even though it was difficult made them closer knit to each other and more, you know, parents and children spent more time with each other and there were things that are busy modern lifestyles didn't allow for it almost forced us to slow down and, you know, take, you know, go on a hike with your family, right, or have actual conversation with your family because that's all you could see, or at least with the people you were living with. So, there are both, I would say the research and anecdotally and research both have showed that there's both the pros and the cons of this situation. JazakAllah khair for that. I mean, at some stage, I'd love to hear more about you. Your strategies or your advice to families who are experiencing difficulties in the pandemics, hopefully in a future episode, inshallah. Moving forward, I'd like to just ask a very broad question. Like, it's been a year now since COVID. What have we as Muslims learned? You mentioned before that we learned that Allah is in full control. And I fully acknowledge that. What are the other things that we've learned as a community and as individuals with regards to, like, what can we take out after a year of this experience?
SubhanAllah, there are so many things to take out of this experience. And I think we're still learning. I don't think we fully have figured it out yet. One thing, I have my list of things. One thing is to remember, this is something I actually learned from the historical research we were doing, was that time is not something that we own. It's something that Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala owns. And we always keep talking about, inshallah, it's only going to be a year. You know, first when we started, it was three weeks, a couple months, okay, maybe a year. But the reality is, when I look back historically at many of the plagues, and granted, this is modern history, and that's pre-modern history in many cases, and they didn't have the kind of resources we have today, like vaccines being developed within the year, before the year was even up, right? And so this might change, but still, many people want to put like a cap on, it has to end by this time. And that's not how Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala does things, right? He determines when it is that things are going to start and end. And so kind of remembering how for some of the plagues in history, they went through cycles, right? Like spikes of up and down, up and down, over a century. Like it would be one plague, but it would cycle throughout. And so inshallah, that doesn't happen to us where it's like, you know, a century worth of COVID, right? Inshallah, it's eradicated well before that. But to think about what does that mean in terms of our relationship with time? And how much do we take it for granted? And how much is there barakah and blessing or lack thereof in our time? And I do really believe that that's one of the biggest lessons out of this needing to, you know, literally put everything to a standstill and nothing is happening at the speed it's supposed to happen in modern times, right? SubhanAllah, that's one big lesson, I think. Another is, you called it realigning, which I really agree with, kind of realigning the way we look at the world and opportunities.
One of the most positive things that I think, and I'll speak here from the woman's world, if you will, we were speaking earlier, Ramadan, and how you were mentioning how community has, you know, is a really key factor and it's really felt like it's been very different, almost like you've lost community in this quarantine. And I think many would say, agree with you, men and women both. On the woman's side, it's really interesting because for many women, their complaint forever has been a lack of community because they can't, not because of the pandemic, we're talking pre-pandemic, couldn't get to the Masjid or mosque community in the first place, right? And there were limited opportunities to engage. And somehow virtually, that's changed. If you look at last Ramadan, you know, there were so many opportunities for women to engage in ibadah, right, and worship virtually, right, through these online portals of qiyams and women's, and male scholars and speakers. And so many women were saying they prayed Tawrwiyah for the very first time in their lives because male members of their family were praying at home, or they themselves attempted it at home for the first time, or attempted like an atikah for a khalwa at home because women can, right, at home for the first time, because they didn't have the social obligations of cooking for everybody and inviting and cleaning up after everybody. And there were, you know, that Ramadan brings about. So there was a lack of community on one hand, but there was all kinds of other spiritual openings and growth on the other hand. So one other thing we're learning from all of this is maybe, you know, what are we, inshallah, what are we meant to take out of all of this? Because I think about when COVID ends and masjids are open again, will the women lose all of what they gained spiritually and access-wise? Like, it maybe helps us kind of rethink and reshift how we run a lot of our institutions and organizations, right? Inshallah. That's my hope at least. I think I just add to that the idea of trust in Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala.
When I think of the pandemic, I think of Allah as al-wakeel, because you're faced with many doors closing in your face, both in terms of work, in terms of social activities, in terms of community, in terms of extended family, maybe seeing extended family or seeing your grandparents, and there's a lot of challenges that come. Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala somehow, in his wisdom, is able to provide during this pandemic. So for me, the biggest lesson was that, you know, Allah is in control, absolutely, and it's important to trust in Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala and not think that we have our hands on every lever in our life. I'm going to ask you a random question. I didn't add this in the earlier plan for this episode, but I feel like answering, asking, I think maybe I'm inspired by all the books behind you. If there is one name of Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala, of the 99 names and attributes that comes to the fore when you think of the pandemic and the research that you've undergone in your various capacities, what is one name of Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala that comes to mind when you think of the pandemic? I think the one that's really, really, I find myself connecting to quite a bit is rahma, right, ar-rahman, and for me, the reason for that is because when I think about even in the origins of the word and what the word is originally tied to, and especially as a woman, I have to say this is very powerful for me because the rahm, the womb that Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala created and named the womb after his own name, because it is, what it does,
right, it's very much, I think about this quarantine and how it's exactly felt this way. It is an isolative, protective, nurturing place that allows you to grow and to really be able to sustain this next stage of life, right, this fetus that's growing inside that's going to become a child inshallah one day once it's ready to be born. And I feel so much that this quarantine has done that, like it's made us, you know, isolate from everything else around us. And for those who've tapped into the spiritual, into spirituality and deen, I hope inshallah, it's also helped us nurture that relationship. And then inshallah, once it's ready to be done and over, it's almost like the cocoon, right, the cocoon where the caterpillar came in, unbeknownst to all of us, we came into this cocoon, right. And then if it goes well, then inshallah, once this is all over, we are meant to emerge out of it, like that newborn baby, like that butterfly, right, that's meant to come out on the other end. And that's all from the rahmah of Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala, that rahm, right, that cocoon, that womb, that's kind of kept us in quarantine in this period of time. That's what I would say has most been the parallel that's most connected to me. You've been really positive during this episode. I didn't think we're going to be that kind of hopeful, talking about COVID-19. I'm going to kind of flip the table and suggest a scenario to you. And basically, what if there was someone who, you know, you're saying that it's been a net positive by and large to 85 or 75% of Muslims, you know, they feel closer to God. And what if I'm one of those 25% who, when I think of the pandemic, I think of Allah punishing me, number one.
And number two, I've struggled in the last year, my marriage broke down, my, you know, my wealth has decreased, I've lost my job. And I certainly haven't used this last year to get closer to Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala. What's your take on someone in that bucket? Absolutely. And that bucket is a very, very, very important bucket because the reality is, and I want to make this very clear too, there is that 25% that don't believe that it's that and we're just this is statistics. Remember, like, these are numbers, this is not etched in stone. We as humans are fluid, we move all the time and how we think and feel about things move with it. And even though in those studies, yes, 25% are, it was a 75-25 kind of split. But even from the 75, I want to make this very clear. It's not like it's a net positive. So I like what you said there, net positive, but on a day to day basis, right, our Iman, our faith and our connection to Allah is kind of like waves that go up and down and up and down. So it's not always high. Like, if you were to talk to me on another day, right, where all kinds of things are breaking down around me, I might say to you the opposite as well, right? It's upon Allah, but the hope is that the net positive, it would be a net positive at the end of it, right? That in the ups and the downs, the struggles, that actually we could come out on the other side, right? Understanding that actually Allah knows whether this is a test and a lot of people have asked, you know, is this a test? This is a punishment, right? And so these are two different things. We know the test part, because Allah has stated as such in the Quran, Allah knows about the punishment. It could be for some and it could be not for the others, right? And that's what the study, interestingly enough, we actually asked that very question on the study as well. And we found that the overwhelming majority of Muslims in the study actually believed that this pandemic was a test. And not a punishment. There was like about a 12% who felt that it was a punishment.
And so, but it's significantly the minority, right, compared to the majority who understood or felt that this is yes, a test, a tribulation, it is difficult, but you can't necessarily call it a punishment. And so to speak to the person who's kind of going through difficulty, who this has been a very, very difficult year, is to acknowledge you and to say, I hear you. And that is your truth. And that is real, right? And from here, the question then becomes, and now what would you like to do with it? Right? Because sometimes it takes falling to rock bottom to be able to get back up again. Sometimes it takes falling flat on our face and losing everything. And kind of before you're able to dust yourself off and kind of mend the scrapes and the bruises and the so on and to get up again and to actually become better, even better than before. And that Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la replaces, one of the duas the Prophet ﷺ would often say is that may Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la replace what you have lost with better than you can even have imagined. And sometimes that's what happens with loss. We literally shed off what we think and we want to hold on so much to that what we used to have because it was ours, but nothing actually in this dunya is actually ours, right? But we hold on to it because we think it's ours. But then Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la makes it go, right? He sheds it from us. We literally shed from our whole system and ourselves only to then grow into something that is actually better to move forward. And that's been a consistent theme in this COVID era that we've been in. And I pray that this is what we come from it is actually better, inshallah ta'ala. But I hear you and it is real and never minimizing the difficulty that's come through this, subhanAllah. So, Dr. Rania, let's assume I'm doing it tough during the pandemic. I don't have a very strong immediate circle.
I'm cut off from friends and family and I'm really struggling and I don't feel close to Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la. What's your advice to me? Absolutely. And I think this is so important to make sure that anybody who feels like what you've described, that this has been difficult and it has been difficult to actually make sure that we reach out for help. And I'll tell you why. You may have heard advice like this before, but here's my take on it. My take on it is that, you know, in the Quran, and yes, I'm going to quote the Quran here, that, you know, Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la specifically asks us to make sure to ask the people of knowledge if we do not know. And when a person is in need of help and is struggling and is having a hard time and things are not seem, I mean, the gray clouds are not going away, right? Things seem really bleak. Reaching out for help and asking someone who does know or can help or is even trained, right, as a professional, a mental health professional, a counselor, a person who has the kind of ability to help not only is important, but actually I would say is part of our deen. And so I really recommend that, you know, we tune into that and we take away all the, you know, any shame or discomfort or stigma or so on of asking for help or even saying, oh, what does it mean to talk to a counselor or a professional? In these, this is exactly, again, if COVID has taught us anything, it's that all of us are struggling, everybody. And in that struggle, we have a spectrum. There are those who are able to do this, you know, because of the different resources and networks and so on that they have to get through or just what their person experiencing maybe isn't and Allah tells us in the Quran, right? He's going to give us each test that differ from one another. And so for some, they're on the spectrum that they're able to actually get through this without that extra level of help. But for others, and then many of us, we actually do need that help. And so I really want to recommend that we reach out for that kind of help and care and
that inshallah, once you knock on the doors, Allah will help open them inshallah to Allah. Jazakallah khair. I have one last question. As has become tradition in the Double Take podcast, if my say nine year old niece was to come to you and ask, I hate COVID, I'm sick of it. I don't get to see my extended family. The good thing is that I'm seeing my parents more often or my dad's more at home and working from home and my mom's helping me with schoolwork. But I'm not enjoying it. And it is affecting, putting a strain on my family's life. And it's changed my life upside down. Is this a punishment from Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala? This is my nine year old niece asking. And when will Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala free everything up again? I would say to your lovely nine year old niece, who's very, very insightful. I would say to her, you know, Allahu ta'ala Adam, right? The reality is I don't know and I don't have the answers. Only Allah knows. And when he's ready to let this lift from us, it will get lifted. That much I can tell you. And that with the difficulty will come ease that much I can tell you because Allah stated so in the Quran. But ultimately, is this a punishment? Allahu ta'ala Adam? It is a test. And it is difficult. And it has strained our relationships and our families. You're probably missing your friends and life the way you knew it beforehand. And I pray that Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala gets us all through this. And so we're going to have to kind of get through this together and know that we're all in this together. Right. And if she's able to comprehend that piece of it, then we can, you know, move forward with that discussion and kind of sometimes, especially with our younger folks, but even ourselves, kind of reassurance of saying, you know, this is one of those tough things
in life, but this too shall pass inshallah ta'ala. Dr. Rania, JazakAllah khair for joining Double Take. Thank you so much and your work on the pandemic and the research you did on the pandemic, but also everything else you're doing at Stanford and everywhere else, mashallah, that you're working. JazakAllah khair and thank you for joining Yaqeen Institute's podcast, Double Take. BarakAllahu feekum. Thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure and my du'as with all of you. Please keep me in your du'as as well. Salam alaikum guys. We hope you've enjoyed the first half of this first season of Double Take. We're going on hiatus for Ramadan so that you can focus on your worship and not have to see me all the time. Feel free to visit the Yaqeen YouTube channel to see all the Ramadan content from Yaqeen Institute. Salam alaikum.
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